Jury hears secret recording of Trump discussing catch-and-kill payment

ABC News
13 May 202413:56

Summary

TLDRIn a tense courtroom atmosphere, Michael Cohen, former attorney for Donald Trump, testifies in a criminal hush money trial involving the former president. The court session, covered by ABC News, includes discussions about payments to Karen McDougal and Stormy Daniels, with Cohen providing key testimony about Trump's involvement. The defense is expected to challenge Cohen's credibility, given his past convictions for lying. The trial has drawn significant attention, with notable figures such as senators and Trump's son, Eric Trump, present in the courtroom. The summary also highlights the lack of eye contact between Trump and Cohen, the jury's attentiveness, and the strategic seating arrangement that allows the two men to avoid looking at each other. The discussion anticipates a potential defense strategy to portray Cohen as the mastermind behind the hush money payments, and the importance of Cohen maintaining his composure under cross-examination.

Takeaways

  • 📚 Michael Cohen, former lawyer for President Trump, is a star witness in a criminal hush money trial involving Trump.
  • 👥 The trial is focused on 34 criminal counts, primarily related to the Stormy Daniels payment scandal.
  • 💬 Cohen testified that he spoke with Trump multiple times a day, which could complicate the defense's argument regarding Trump's knowledge of Cohen's actions.
  • 👀 There was a notable lack of eye contact between Trump and Cohen in the courtroom, with both men looking straight ahead.
  • 👥 The jury appeared to be attentive and focused, taking notes throughout the proceedings.
  • 🚨 Brian Buckmire, a legal contributor, is anticipating a 'smoking gun' moment in the testimony that could significantly impact the trial.
  • 🤔 The defense is expected to focus on attacking Cohen's credibility, highlighting his past lies and convictions.
  • 👨‍👩‍👧‍👦 Several members of Trump's family and campaign apparatus were present in court, including Eric Trump and two U.S. Senators, signaling a show of support.
  • 🤐 Trump did not engage with anyone else in the courtroom, maintaining a forward gaze throughout the proceedings.
  • 👮‍♂️ The presence of key figures in the courtroom suggests an attempt to keep Trump calm and project an image of unity and support.
  • 👵 Melania Trump is not expected to attend the trial, reflecting her past reaction to the Stormy Daniels and Karen McDougal stories.

Q & A

  • What is the current status of the court proceedings mentioned in the transcript?

    -The court is currently in recess after a tense morning of testimonies.

  • Who is the star witness providing testimony in the trial?

    -Michael Cohen, former lawyer and fixer for President Trump, is the star witness.

  • What is the focus of Michael Cohen's testimony?

    -The focus is on the alleged criminal hush money trial involving President Trump.

  • What are some key elements of the case that have been discussed so far?

    -Key elements include the doorman's jewelry, the Karen McDougal story, and an audio recording of Donald Trump and Michael Cohen discussing the payment to Karen McDougal via AMI and David Pecker.

  • What is the significance of the Stormy Daniels story in this case?

    -The Stormy Daniels story is central to the case, as the 34 criminal counts are built around it.

  • How did Michael Cohen describe his interactions with Donald Trump?

    -Cohen testified that he spoke with Trump multiple times a day.

  • What is the defense's strategy regarding Michael Cohen's testimony?

    -The defense is likely to focus on questioning Cohen's credibility, given his past convictions for lying.

  • What was observed about the demeanor of the jury during the court proceedings?

    -The jury was observed to be stone-cold, watching everything, taking notes, and paying close attention to the proceedings.

  • What is the significance of the presence of Donald Trump's family and campaign apparatus in the courtroom?

    -Their presence is a show of force and support for Trump, aiming to create an image of unity and strength.

  • Why might Melania Trump not be present at the court proceedings?

    -Melania Trump has historically avoided public involvement in these types of scandals, and her absence is likely due to the personal nature of the allegations.

  • What is expected to be the defense's approach during Michael Cohen's cross-examination?

    -The defense is expected to be surgical in their approach, focusing on Cohen's credibility and painting him as the ringleader in the alleged scheme.

Outlines

00:00

📚 Courtroom Tensions and Testimonies

The first paragraph discusses the ongoing recess in the trial involving former President Trump's alleged criminal hush money payments. Michael Cohen, Trump's former lawyer, is a star witness whose testimony could significantly impact the trial's outcome. The discussion among ABC News contributors includes observations about the pace of the trial, the focus on the Stormy Daniels story, and the lack of eye contact between Cohen and Trump during the proceedings. The jury's attentiveness is highlighted, as is the contrast between this trial and a previous civil trial involving Trump.

05:00

👥 High-Profile Attendance and Support for Trump

The second paragraph focuses on the notable figures present in court, signaling support for Donald Trump. Mentioned are two U.S. Senators, Tommy Tuberville and J.D. Vance, as well as Eric Trump, Trump's son. The paragraph explores the strategic reasons behind this show of force, including the political message it sends and its potential impact on Trump's demeanor during the trial. It also discusses the absence of certain family members, particularly Melania Trump, and the reasons why she and others might not be present.

10:02

🕵️‍♂️ Anticipating Defense Strategy and Cohen's Conduct

In the third paragraph, the anticipation builds around Michael Cohen's performance on the witness stand and the potential tactics the defense might employ. There is speculation about whether Cohen might lose his composure under pressure, which the defense could use to their advantage by painting him as unstable. The discussion also touches on Cohen's background as an attorney and how that might influence his behavior during the cross-examination. The paragraph concludes with the observation that the trial is about to resume and the participants are preparing for the next phase of the proceedings.

Mindmap

Keywords

💡Michael Cohen

Michael Cohen is a former personal attorney for Donald Trump. In the script, he is a star witness testifying in a criminal hush money trial, which is central to the case's narrative. His testimony is expected to significantly influence the trial's outcome, given his close association with Trump and his involvement in the alleged hush money payments.

💡Donald Trump

Donald Trump, the former President of the United States, is a key figure in the trial mentioned in the script. The case revolves around allegations of criminal hush money payments, which are suggested to have been orchestrated to benefit Trump during his presidential campaign.

💡Hush Money Trial

The hush money trial refers to the legal proceedings discussed in the script, where it is alleged that criminal acts were committed to silence individuals during Trump's presidential campaign. The payments are central to the case, and the script details testimonies and evidence related to these payments.

💡Karen McDougal

Karen McDougal is mentioned in the script as one of the individuals involved in the hush money case. Her story is part of the testimonies and is tied to the allegations against Trump, as it is suggested that money was paid to keep her story quiet.

💡AMI (American Media Inc.)

AMI, specifically David Pecker who is the chairman, is referenced in the context of paying off Karen McDougal. The script suggests that AMI, through the 'National Enquirer,' was involved in the alleged hush money payments, which is a significant element in the trial.

💡Stormy Daniels

Stormy Daniels is another key figure in the hush money allegations. The script indicates that a significant portion of the trial focuses on the payments made to her, which are part of the 34 criminal counts built around this single incident.

💡Jury

The jury is an integral part of the court process described in the script. They are depicted as attentive observers, taking notes and closely following the proceedings, which underscores the seriousness and importance of their role in determining the outcome of the trial.

💡Credibility

Credibility is a pivotal concept in the script, as it relates to the defense's strategy to discredit Michael Cohen's testimony. It is suggested that the defense will focus on Cohen's past lies and convictions to cast doubt on his reliability as a witness.

💡Civil Case

The civil case is contrasted with the current criminal proceedings in the script. It refers to previous legal actions involving Trump and Cohen, where the scope was broader and involved more documentation. The civil case serves as a backdrop to the personal and focused nature of the current criminal trial.

💡Campaign Apparatus

The campaign apparatus refers to the team and machinery that supported Donald Trump's presidential campaign. The script mentions their presence in the courtroom, suggesting a show of support and highlighting the political implications of the trial.

💡Direct Examination

Direct examination is a legal term referring to the initial questioning of a witness by the side that called them. In the script, it is suggested that Michael Cohen's direct examination has been relatively uneventful, with anticipation building for the defense's cross-examination.

💡Cross-Examination

Cross-examination is the questioning of a witness by the opposing side in a trial. The script anticipates a more aggressive line of questioning during the defense's cross-examination of Michael Cohen, aiming to challenge his credibility and version of events.

Highlights

Michael Cohen, former lawyer for President Trump, is testifying in a criminal hush money trial.

Cohen's testimony could be pivotal in determining the outcome of the trial.

The court proceedings have been tense and expedited, moving quickly into key issues.

Discussions about the payments to Karen McDougal and the involvement of AMI's David Pecker have been addressed.

The Stormy Daniels story is central to the case, with 34 criminal counts built around it.

Michael Cohen's eye contact, or lack thereof, in the courtroom has been noticeable.

Donald Trump and Michael Cohen have avoided looking at each other throughout the proceedings.

The jury has remained stone cold and attentive, taking notes throughout the testimony.

Legal contributor Brian Buckmire is anticipating a 'smoking gun' in the testimony.

The courtroom layout allows Trump and Cohen to avoid direct eye contact during the trial.

Eric Trump's presence in the courtroom is seen as a show of support and force.

The defense's strategy is expected to focus on casting doubt on Cohen's credibility.

Cohen's admission of lying for Trump may aid the prosecution's case.

The absence of certain Trump family members from the court is being highlighted.

Melania Trump is not expected to attend the proceedings due to past events.

The defense may attempt to paint Cohen as the ringleader of the hush money scheme.

Cohen's temperament and ability to remain calm under questioning will be tested.

Previous testimony hints at Cohen's emotional state, which the defense might use to question his stability.

Cohen's background as an attorney could both help and hinder his performance on the witness stand.

Transcripts

00:03

.

00:03

I AM DIANE MACEDO TODAY

00:05

ON ABC NEWS LIVE FIRST COURT

00:06

IS NOW IN RECESS.

00:06

A STAR WITNESS, MICHAEL COHEN,

00:07

TESTIFIES FORMER

00:10

PRESIDENT TRUMP'S CRIMINAL HUSH

00:10

MONEY TRIAL.

00:11

TRUMP'S FORMER LAWYER FIXERS

00:14

PROVIDING TESTIMONY THAT COULD

00:14

ULTIMATELY DETERMINE

00:15

THE OUTCOME OF THE TRIAL.

00:17

ABC NEWS EXECUTIVE EDITORIAL

00:18

PRODUCER JOHN SANTUCCI SENIOR

00:22

REPORTER, KATHERINE FAULDERS

00:22

AND LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR

00:23

BRIAN BUCKMIRE JOIN ME NOW FOR

00:25

MORE ON THIS.

00:25

>> JOHN, WHAT'S THE LATEST FROM

00:26

COURT?

00:26

WE'RE ON A BREAK.

00:29

IT'S BEEN A REALLY TENSE

00:30

MORNING SO FAR.

00:30

SO I THINK THAT BREAK IS NEEDED

00:31

FOR EVERYBODY IN THE ROOM.

00:33

I THINK WHAT'S BEEN INTERESTING

00:34

FROM JUST OUR TEAM'S

00:34

OBSERVATIONS IS HOW QUICKLY WE

00:37

MOVED PAST THE NICETIES, IF

00:38

YOU WILL RIGHT INTO THE MEAT

00:41

AND POTATOES.

00:41

THIS CASE, WE'VE GOTTEN

00:42

THE DOORMAN'S JEWELRY WE'VE

00:44

GOTTEN THE KAREN MCDOUGAL

00:44

STORY, WE'VE GOTTEN THE AUDIO

00:45

RECORDING OF DONALD TRUMP AND

00:48

MICHAEL COHEN TALKING ABOUT HOW

00:49

KAREN MCDOUGAL WAS GOING TO BE

00:49

PAID OFF BY AMI DAVID PECKER

00:52

IN THE "NATIONAL ENQUIRER".

00:53

I THINK IT'S REMARKABLE

00:56

HOW FAST THINGS ARE MOVING

00:56

IN THIS COURTROOM, BECAUSE

00:57

AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE KNOW

01:00

THERE IS GOING TO BE A LOT

01:01

OF TIME AND ENERGY NEEDED TO BE

01:04

SPENT ON THE STORMY DANIELS

01:05

STORY, BECAUSE THAT'S THE STORY

01:07

THAT IS THE ONE OF THIS ENTIRE

01:08

CASE, THESE 34 CRIMINAL COUNTS

01:10

ARE BUILT AROUND, DIANE.

01:11

SO IT'S INTERESTING IN THAT

01:14

RESPECT.

01:14

THE OTHER OBSERVATIONS JUST

01:15

FROM OUR TEAM COLLECTIVELY, IF

01:15

I CAN QUICKLY HIT THEM ONE.

01:17

THE EYE CONTACT AND LACK

01:18

THEREOF.

01:18

MICHAEL COHEN LOOKING STRAIGHT

01:21

AHEAD.

01:22

A PROSECUTOR, IS DONALD

01:22

TRUMP EYES CLOSED SOMETIMES

01:25

SWAYING HIS HEAD A LITTLE BIT,

01:25

BUT LOOKING STRAIGHT AHEAD

01:26

AS WELL.

01:26

VERY LITTLE FROM EITHER MAN

01:30

IN THAT COURTROOM.

01:31

AND TWO MEN.

01:31

LET'S BE CLEAR THAT TO EACH

01:33

OTHER MULTIPLE TIMES A DAY,

01:34

AS MICHAEL COHEN TESTIFIED.

01:37

THE JURY, INTERESTINGLY, STONE

01:38

COLD THROUGHOUT ALL OF THIS.

01:38

THEY'RE WATCHING EVERYTHING

01:42

TAKING NOTES, KIND OF LIKE

01:42

YOU'RE DOING RIGHT NOW,

01:43

PAYING ATTENTION TO EVERYTHING

01:45

THAT IS HAPPENING IN THAT

01:45

COURTROOM, BECAUSE I THINK

01:46

THERE'S A LOT THAT PROSECUTORS

01:49

ARE VERY QUICKLY TRYING TO TICK

01:50

THROUGH WITH MICHAEL COHEN

01:50

AS WE BUILD UP TO THE STORMY

01:53

DANIELS PAYMENT.

01:53

>> BRIAN, WHAT STICKS OUT

01:54

TO YOU FROM THIS TESTIMONY SO

01:57

FAR?

01:57

INTERESTING.

01:57

NOT THAT MUCH.

01:58

IT'S -- IT'S EXACTLY AS WE

02:01

EXPECTED IT TO KIND OF PLAY OUT

02:02

SO FAR, KIND OF MARCHING OUT

02:02

STEP BY STEP.

02:05

AND I'M ACTUALLY WAITING FOR

02:06

SOMETHING TO STICK OUT.

02:06

I'M WAITING FOR THAT KIND

02:08

OF SMOKING GUN.

02:09

AND I THINK WE MIGHT EXPECT IT

02:09

GOING FORWARD.

02:12

BUT RIGHT NOW, IF YOU TOLD ME

02:13

THIS WAS WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN

02:15

3 HOURS AGO, I WAS LIKE, YEAH,

02:16

THAT THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE

02:18

.

02:19

>> WHAT I DO WANT TO DO IS I

02:19

WANT TO GIVE A LITTLE CONTEXT

02:20

IN TERMS OF HOW THE COURTROOM

02:21

OPERATES BECAUSE MAYBE NOT

02:22

EVERYONE'S BEEN IN A

02:23

NEW YORK CITY COURTROOM.

02:23

WHEN YOU WALK INTO COURTROOM,

02:26

ON THE RIGHT SIDE IS ALWAYS

02:27

WHERE THE DEFENSE TABLE IS.

02:28

AND ON THE LEFT IS THE

02:31

PROSECUTION.

02:31

AND IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE

02:32

JUDGE, THE JUDGE HAS

02:34

THE TYPICALLY ON THEIR

02:35

RIGHT SIDE.

02:35

SO WHEN WHEN JOHN TALKS

02:35

ABOUT BOTH MEN BE ABLE TO JUST

02:38

STARE STRAIGHT FORWARD,

02:39

THEY CAN ACTUALLY SIT IN THAT

02:39

COURTROOM, WHICH SHOULD BE VERY

02:43

TIGHT AT TIMES AND NOT

02:43

ACTUALLY LOOK AT EACH OTHER.

02:44

>> SO, AGAIN, DONALD

02:46

TRUMP BEING ON THE RIGHT SIDE

02:46

IS LOOKING FORWARD AND COHEN

02:49

LOOKING DIRECTLY AT THE

02:50

PROSECUTORS TABLE WITH A JURY

02:51

TO HIS RIGHT.

02:53

BUT, JOHN, THAT'S A STARK

02:54

CONTRAST TO WHEN COHEN

02:55

TESTIFIED IN THE CIVIL TRIAL

02:58

AGAINST TRUMP.

02:58

>> WELL, BUT I ALSO THINK

02:59

THAT DONALD TRUMP WAS A SHARP

03:00

CONTRAST TO DONALD TRUMP IN

03:01

THESE PROCEEDINGS.

03:01

RIGHT.

03:02

BECAUSE THE CIVIL CASE,

03:04

HE COULD GO WHEN HE WANTED.

03:05

RIGHT.

03:05

IT'S ALMOST LIKE HE MADE AN

03:06

APPOINTMENT AT ONE POINT WHEN

03:09

MICHAEL COHEN WAS SUPPOSED

03:09

TO TAKE THE STAND.

03:10

IN THAT CASE, HE ACTUALLY ENDED

03:12

UP NOT GETTING CALLED BY

03:13

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL THAT DAY.

03:14

SO IN HINDSIGHT, WHICH

03:16

IS ACTUALLY INTERESTING HERE

03:17

IN THESE PROCEEDINGS, DIANE,

03:18

THIS IS THE REAL FACE OFF

03:21

THAT YOU CAN'T AVOID.

03:21

AND I THINK THAT FOR DONALD

03:24

TRUMP, THIS IS THE CASE WHERE

03:25

IT'S JUST IT'S SO PERSONAL,

03:28

RIGHT?

03:29

BECAUSE LOOK WHAT'S HAPPENED,

03:29

RIGHT?

03:29

WE TALK ABOUT THE CIVIL CASE.

03:32

THE CIVIL CASE WAS BIGGER THAN

03:33

MICHAEL COHEN, RIGHT.

03:34

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL BEEN

03:36

WORKING ON IT FOR YEARS.

03:37

THERE WAS A LOT MORE DOCUMENTS

03:37

AND RECORDS AND MATERIAL

03:40

THAT WENT INTO THAT CASE BEYOND

03:41

ONE INCIDENT.

03:41

THIS IS ALL ABOUT ONE INCIDENT,

03:45

ONE INCIDENT THAT ONLY

03:46

THREE MEN KNEW ABOUT DONALD

03:47

TRUMP.

03:47

DAVID PECKER.

03:47

MICHAEL COHEN.

03:48

HERE'S THE PROBLEM ONE OF THEM

03:51

TALKED.

03:51

>> KATHERINE COHEN ALSO

03:52

TESTIFIED THAT HE SPOKE

03:54

TRUMP MULTIPLE TIMES A DAY.

03:55

AS JOHN JUST POINTED OUT.

03:59

HOW DIFFICULT DOES THAT MAKE IT

03:59

FOR THE DEFENSE TO TRY TO SAY

04:00

THAT TRUMP KNOW ABOUT SOME

04:02

OF THE THINGS THAT COHEN WAS

04:03

DOING?

04:03

>> YEAH IT DOES MAKE IT QUITE

04:06

DIFFICULT FOR THE DEFENSE TEAM.

04:07

I'M CURIOUS HOW THEY TRY

04:10

AND POKE HOLES IN THAT, GIVEN

04:10

THAT COHEN WAS ONE OF

04:11

THE CLOSEST TO TRUMP SINCE

04:14

THE VERY BEGINNING, FRANKLY.

04:14

SO THE FACT THAT THEY TALKED

04:18

EVERY DAY, HE RECALLS

04:18

CONVERSATIONS SPECIFIC,

04:21

CONVERSATIONS THAT HE HAD

04:22

WITH TRUMP ABOUT THESE

04:22

PAYMENTS.

04:23

IT DOES AT END OF THE DAY, MAKE

04:26

IT DIFFICULT FOR THE DEFENSE.

04:26

I THINK THE DEFENSE TEAM,

04:27

TRUMP'S LAWYERS ARE REALLY

04:29

GOING TO TRY AND FOCUS

04:29

ON COHEN'S CREDIBILITY.

04:33

ALL THEY HAVE HERE,

04:33

THEY'RE GOING TO SAY THAT HE'S

04:34

A LIAR AND HE'S BEEN

04:37

CONVICTED OF LYING

04:37

AND THEREFORE HE SHOULDN'T

04:38

BE BELIEVED.

04:38

FOR EXAMPLE, COHEN DID SAY

04:41

THAT HE ON THE STAND TODAY

04:41

THAT HE LIED FOR DONALD TRUMP.

04:45

THAT MIGHT HELP PROSECUTORS

04:45

IN TERMS OF THE REASONS WHY

04:47

HE WAS LYING.

04:48

BUT THAT'S WHAT TRUMP'S DEFENSE

04:48

REALLY HINGES ON HERE,

04:52

THAT BECAUSE HE'S LYING,

04:52

IT'S JUST HIS WORD AGAINST

04:55

THERE'S THERE'S NOTHING REALLY

04:56

TO BE BELIEVED HERE.

04:57

IT DOES MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT

05:00

THAT THIS IS SOMEBODY WHO TRUMP

05:01

HAD IN HIS INNER CIRCLE FOR

05:03

YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS.

05:03

>> AND JOHN COURT'S IN RECESS

05:04

NOW.

05:04

BUT WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF WHO'S

05:06

IN COURT TODAY?

05:07

I MEAN, THE BETTER QUESTION

05:07

IS WHO'S NOT IN COURT TODAY?

05:11

EVERYBODY IS IN COURT TODAY.

05:11

BASICALLY, SO MANY OF DONALD

05:15

TRUMP'S CAMPAIGN APPARATUS

05:15

IS IN THERE.

05:15

WE HAVE TWO UNITED STATES

05:16

SENATORS IN THERE TODAY, TOMMY

05:18

TUBERVILLE, THE SENATOR FROM

05:19

ALABAMA, J.D. VANCE,

05:22

A POTENTIAL VEEPSTAKES

05:22

CONTENDER FOR DONALD TRUMP FROM

05:23

OHIO, IS IN THE COURTROOM.

05:26

HIS SON, ERIC TRUMP, IS IN

05:26

THE COURTROOM.

05:27

THIS IS A SHOW OF FORCE TODAY,

05:30

RIGHT?

05:30

THIS IS A WAY TO SHOW EVERYBODY

05:31

IS HERE SUPPORTING ME, BECAUSE

05:34

I'M THE REPUBLICAN NOMINEE.

05:34

I SHOULD NOT BE HERE TODAY.

05:37

I SHOULD BE OUT ON THE CAMPAIGN

05:38

TRAIL.

05:38

MAYBE NOT SO MUCH ALABAMA

05:41

BECAUSE HE'S GOT THAT LOCKED UP

05:41

AS A REPUBLICAN.

05:42

BUT OHIO WILL BE A GOOD PLACE

05:43

TO GO.

05:45

ALL OF IT IS MEANT TO CREATE

05:45

THE IMAGE OF I DON'T NEED

05:49

TO HERE.

05:49

THIS IS A JOKE TO DONALD TRUMP.

05:50

IT'S ALSO, THOUGH I, THINK

05:52

IN PART A WAY TO HELP

05:53

KEEP DONALD TRUMP CALM.

05:55

RIGHT THE MORE PEOPLE THERE,

05:56

AS PEOPLE HAVE ARGUED AND YOU

05:57

AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS,

05:59

BRIAN, THAT IT'S A TACTIC.

06:00

RIGHT.

06:00

A LITTLE BIT OF JUST BEING ABLE

06:03

HIM TO LOOK AROUND AND TALK

06:04

TO PEOPLE, GET A HEAD NOT OR

06:04

SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES.

06:07

I WILL SAY, THOUGH, WITH ALL

06:08

OF THOSE PEOPLE IN THE ROOM,

06:10

EVERYTHING WE'VE OBSERVED

06:11

IN OUR TEAM IS LITERALLY

06:11

RIGHT BEHIND DONALD TRUMP THIS

06:12

MORNING.

06:14

DIANE HASN'T DONE THAT ONCE,

06:15

HASN'T TURNED AROUND.

06:15

HAS ANYBODY?

06:18

IT REALLY ENGAGED ANYBODY ELSE

06:19

IN THE ROOM?

06:19

I THINK THIS IS THE DAY THAT IS

06:22

JUST SO HARD FOR HIM TO HEAR

06:23

ANY BIT OF IT.

06:27

>> AND AGAIN, I SHARE THAT I

06:27

THINK JUST EARLIER.

06:28

BUT JUST TO GO AT IT AGAIN,

06:30

THIS WAS A PERSON THAT DIDN'T

06:30

WORK FOR DONALD TRUMP AND

06:31

SHOWED LOYALTY TO DONALD TRUMP.

06:34

IT WAS THAT REASON THAT HE

06:35

BECAME AN EMPLOYEE OF DONALD

06:37

TRUMP'S THAT TRUMP CREATED

06:37

A JOB FOR MICHAEL COHEN.

06:38

AT THE END OF THE DAY, DESPITE

06:41

THE STRONG SHOW OF SUPPORT HIM

06:45

ONLY ERIC TRUMP FROM THE FAMILY

06:46

HAS SHOWN UP.

06:49

ARE YOU SURPRISED WE HAVEN'T

06:50

SEEN MORE FAMILY MEMBERS?

06:50

I'M NOT IN COURT THROUGHOUT

06:53

COURSE OF THIS CASE.

06:53

I'M NOT PARTICULARLY NOW.

06:54

YEAH, I'M NOT BECAUSE YOU GOT

06:57

TO REMEMBER THAT EVERY MEMBER

06:58

OF THE TRUMP FAMILY IS A LITTLE

06:58

DIFFERENT.

06:59

AND WHAT I MEAN BY THAT

07:01

IS IVANKA TRUMP HAS NOT BEEN

07:02

SEEN THIS ENTIRE.

07:05

RIGHT.

07:05

THINK ABOUT IT.

07:06

WHEN DONALD TRUMP ANNOUNCED

07:07

HIS FIRST PRESIDENTIAL BID,

07:08

WHERE MICHAEL COHEN ACTUALLY,

07:11

FUN STORY, RAN THE ROOM,

07:12

THERE'S A STORY I'LL TELL

07:12

YOU ALL CLIENTS REALLY GOOD BUT

07:15

ANYWAY TEASE BUT THE REALITY

07:19

IS THAT THAT WAS MICHAEL COHEN

07:20

SHOW BUT IT WAS A SHOW

07:20

THAT DEBUTED WITH IVANA TRUMP.

07:24

SHE INTRODUCED DONALD TRUMP,

07:24

THE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE.

07:27

SHE HAS NOT BEEN TO HIS MOST

07:28

RECENT PRESIDENTIAL KICKOFF,

07:31

THOUGH.

07:31

SHE'S NOW A FLORIDIAN LIKE

07:32

DONALD TRUMP.

07:32

SHE DIDN'T MAKE THE DRIVE UP

07:33

FROM MIAMI, PALM BEACH.

07:35

YOU KNOW, DONALD TRUMP JR

07:36

IS MORE THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL FOR

07:38

DAD IS MORE OUT AND ABOUT DOING

07:39

OTHER.

07:42

AS WE JUST REPORTED ON ABC NEWS

07:43

A COUPLE OF SECONDS AGO,

07:44

DIANE DONALD JUNIOR

07:46

ACTUALLY WAS OUT OF FEDERAL

07:47

PRISON THIS WEEKEND VISITING

07:50

ALLIES OF DONALD TRUMP,

07:50

THE FORMER PRESIDENT BEING

07:54

PETER, OF COURSE, AS YOU KNOW,

07:55

HE WAS CONVICTED FOR NOT

07:55

COMPLYING WITH.

07:58

A JANUARY SIX COMMITTEE

07:59

SUBPOENA ULTIMATELY IS TRIED

07:59

TO APPEAL THAT.

08:02

SO FAR UNSUCCESSFUL.

08:02

HE'S GOT ONE MORE APPEAL OUT

08:03

THERE.

08:03

HIS TEAM HOPES.

08:06

BUT IT'S JUST NOT REALISTIC.

08:07

BUT I'M NOT SURPRISED.

08:07

I THINK THE OTHER QUESTION

08:10

THAT EVERYBODY HAS ASKED ME

08:11

THROUGHOUT ALL THIS COVERAGE

08:13

ARE, WE GOING TO SEE MELANIA.

08:14

NO, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO SEE

08:15

MELANIA I'M SORRY, SHE'S NOT

08:18

GOING TO COME TO THESE

08:18

PROCEEDINGS BECAUSE, AGAIN,

08:19

THINK ABOUT WHEN ALL THESE

08:22

STORIES CAME OUT, WE REPORTED

08:22

IT IN REAL TIME.

08:25

I WISH YOU WERE UP HERE WITH ME

08:25

BECAUSE I'D BE LOOKING AT YOU

08:26

RIGHT NOW BECAUSE WE DID THIS

08:27

TOGETHER.

08:28

MELANIA TRUMP LEFT THE WHITE

08:29

HOUSE WHEN STORMY DANIELS KAREN

08:32

MCDOUGAL CAME OUT WITH THEIR

08:33

STORIES.

08:33

SHE COULDN'T TAKE IT.

08:36

HOPE HICKS TESTIFIED THEY KEPT

08:37

NEWSPAPERS OUT OF THE RESIDENCE

08:38

JUST TO KEEP IT AWAY FROM

08:41

MELANIA AND DONALD TRUMP.

08:41

SO IF ANYBODY WOULD THINK

08:44

BE THERE TODAY OR ANY DAY FOR

08:45

THIS TRIAL NOW, IT'S NOT

08:46

HAPPENING.

08:49

CATHERINE, I SEE YOU NODDING.

08:49

YOU WANT TO ADD TO THAT?

08:50

WELL, NO, JOHN'S RIGHT.

08:52

SHE'S NOT GOING TO SHOW UP.

08:53

IT'S SOMETHING THAT JOHN AND I

08:54

HAVE TALKED ABOUT OFFLINE.

08:56

OBVIOUSLY, WHEN THIS HAPPENED,

08:56

SHE WAS NOWHERE TO BE.

08:59

I CANNOT IMAGINE THAT WE

09:00

WILL SEE AT LEAST MEMBERS

09:03

OF THIS CLOSE FAMILY.

09:03

WE'VE SEEN SOME.

09:04

BUT YOU CERTAINLY WILL NOT SEE

09:07

MELANIA TRUMP THERE.

09:07

>> BRIAN, HAVE YOU HEARD ANY

09:11

RED FLAGS IN MICHAEL COHEN'S

09:11

TESTIMONY SO FAR AREAS WHERE

09:15

YOU THINK THE DEFENSE IS GOING

09:15

TO JUMP ALL OVER THAT, NOT

09:17

AS YET?

09:18

I THINK THERE ARE DEFINITELY

09:18

PARTS OF HIS DIRECT EXAMINATION

09:21

WHERE THE DEFENSE WILL REVISIT

09:22

AND ASK SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT,

09:23

BUT NOTHING THEY'RE REALLY

09:25

GOING TO DIG INTO.

09:26

I THINK THEY'RE THEY'RE GOING

09:27

TO BE SOMEWHAT SURGICAL IN THIS

09:29

AND FOCUS ON HIS CREDIBILITY.

09:29

THE ACTUAL STORY OF TRYING

09:33

TO PUT TOGETHER THIS CATCH

09:34

AND KILL SCHEME.

09:34

THEY'RE GOING TO TRY TO PAINT

09:37

HIM AS THE RINGLEADER.

09:37

AND DONALD TRUMP KIND OF JUST

09:38

IS THERE FOR THE RIDE, SO

09:41

TO SPEAK, BECAUSE MICHAEL COHEN

09:41

HAS ALREADY PUT OUT THAT HE

09:43

WOULD LIE FOR DONALD TRUMP.

09:44

BUT I THINK THEY'RE GOING

09:45

TO TRY TO PUT PEOPLE THAT

09:47

TOWARDS YOU LIE BECAUSE

09:48

YOU KNEW IT WOULD BENEFIT HIM.

09:49

YOU KNEW YOU LIED, YOU KNEW IT

09:52

WOULD BENEFIT YOURSELF.

09:52

THIS ISN'T A MASTER PLAN

09:53

OF DONALD TRUMP TO MASTER PLAN

09:55

OF YOURS.

09:55

I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE'RE

09:56

STARTING TO GET IN THE

09:56

TESTIMONY I THINK THAT'S WHERE

09:59

THEY'LL FOCUS COME

10:00

CROSS-EXAMINATION.

10:01

>> JOHN, WHAT ARE YOU WATCHING

10:02

FOR NEXT?

10:02

>> I'M WATCHING FOR WHEN

10:03

MICHAEL COHEN SAYS SOMETHING

10:06

THAT THE DEFENSE WILL JUMP

10:07

ON OR, LOSES HIS COOL AT ANY

10:10

POINT.

10:10

I THINK MICHAEL COHEN IS.

10:11

I MEAN, IT'S NO, NOT ME.

10:14

JUST HYPOTHESIZING.

10:15

MICHAEL COHEN'S KNOWN AS A

10:15

HOTHEAD.

10:18

I MEAN, EVERYBODY WHO'S BEEN

10:18

SCREAMED AT BY MICHAEL COHEN,

10:19

IF YOU COVERED DONALD

10:21

TRUMP BACK IN THE DAY, PRESENT

10:22

AND ACCOUNTED FOR AT THIS TABLE

10:25

IS A GUY THAT, YOU KNOW, WE

10:25

EVEN SAW IN THOSE TIC TAC

10:29

VIDEOS THAT WE BROKE FIRST

10:29

ON ABC NEWS, DIANE, THAT,

10:30

YOU KNOW, HE COULDN'T HELP

10:32

HIMSELF.

10:33

RIGHT.

10:33

TALKING ABOUT THE CASE EVEN

10:34

WHEN HE SAID PREVIOUSLY

10:37

HE WASN'T GOING TO.

10:37

AND WHEN OUR STORY CAME OUT

10:40

AND HE THEN SAID HE WASN'T

10:40

GOING TO AGAIN, HE THEN SHOWED

10:41

UP WEARING A T SHIRT OF DONALD

10:44

TRUMP BEHIND BARS, A CARICATURE

10:44

OF DONALD TRUMP.

10:45

>> SO I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW,

10:48

LISTEN, IT'S BEEN A COUPLE

10:49

HOURS.

10:49

IT'S ALL BEEN FINE.

10:52

BUT I THINK AS THE QUESTIONS

10:52

GET HOTTER, THE TOPICS

10:55

GET HEAVIER AS TIME GOES ON,

10:56

WHEN THE DEFENSE GETS UP THERE

10:59

,MICHAEL COHEN IS REALLY GOING

11:00

TO NEED TO BITE HIS LIP AND TRY

11:01

TO KEEP HIS COOL BECAUSE

11:03

WHAT THE DEFENSE WANTS TO DO,

11:03

RIGHT.

11:04

THEY WANT TO SHOW THE JURY

11:06

THAT THIS IS A GUY THAT'S NOT

11:07

STABLE.

11:07

THEY CAN'T KEEP IT TOGETHER.

11:08

AND THAT'S MICHAEL COHEN

11:11

IS REALLY GOING TO BE TESTED.

11:11

>> BRIAN, THERE WAS ALSO A PART

11:14

IN PREVIOUS TESTIMONY WHERE I,

11:18

I CAN'T REMEMBER NOW IF IT WAS

11:19

KEITH DAVIDSON OR DAVID PECKER

11:19

SAID THAT THEY WERE SO WORRIED

11:22

ABOUT MICHAEL COHEN WHEN

11:22

HE TALKED ABOUT HIS RESPONSE,

11:26

TRUMP LEAVING TO THE WHITE

11:26

HOUSE AND NOT HIRING MICHAEL

11:27

COHEN TO COME WITH HIM,

11:30

THAT ACTUALLY WORRIED MICHAEL

11:30

COHEN MIGHT TAKE HIS OWN LIFE.

11:31

DO YOU EXPECT THAT COME

11:34

BACK NOW IN TERMS OF AN ATTEMPT

11:34

TO QUESTION HIS STATE OF MIND?

11:37

IF IT DOES, THEN I THINK IT

11:38

WOULD BE SUSTAINED.

11:38

I CAN'T IMAGINE THAT A

11:41

JUDGE WILL ALLOW THAT.

11:41

I'M JUST KIND OF RUNNING

11:42

THROUGH THE EVIDENTIARY RULES

11:45

TO WHY THAT WOULD BE RELEVANT

11:45

AND WHY WOULD NOT

11:46

BE OBJECTIONABLE.

11:49

IT MIGHT BE A THEME THAT COMES

11:50

UP IN THE SENSE THE DEFENSE

11:50

WANTS TO ASK THAT QUESTION,

11:53

KNOWING THAT IT'S GOING TO GET

11:54

SUSTAINED.

11:54

BUT IT GOES TO THAT THEORY

11:55

OF YOU UNRING THAT BELL

11:56

AND IT'S UP TO THE JURY

11:57

TO DECIDE HOW THEY WANT

12:00

NAVIGATE THROUGH

12:00

THAT INFORMATION.

12:00

EVEN THOUGH A JUDGE WILL SAY

12:01

DON'T CONSIDER IT TO YOUR

12:04

ULTIMATE STANCE.

12:04

BUT YEAH, TO JOHN'S POINT, IF

12:05

YOU CAN SHOW THAT THE STAR

12:07

WITNESS IS UNSTABLE, THAT HELPS

12:08

THE DEFENSE IN EVERY WAY.

12:11

AND I THINK WE'RE NOT GOING

12:12

TO SEE THE AGGRESSIVE MICHAEL

12:15

COHEN ON DIRECT EXAMINATION.

12:19

BUT HOW WE SAW THE MICHAEL

12:20

SORRY, THE STORMY DANIELS

12:20

CROSS-EXAMINATION, WHICH

12:22

STARTED OFF PRETTY FIERY

12:23

AND CONTINUED ON AS WELL.

12:23

I THINK WE'RE GOING TO SEE

12:26

THAT AND THEN SOME WHEN IT

12:27

COMES TO MICHAEL COHEN TO TRY

12:27

TO THROW HIM OFF HIS GAME.

12:30

>> HE'S A HOTHEAD, BUT HE'S

12:31

ALSO AN ATTORNEY.

12:31

>> DOES THAT HELP YOU?

12:35

>> HE'S BEEN ON THE OTHER END

12:36

OF THIS OR SOME OF THE BIGGEST

12:36

HOTHEADS I KNOW OR ATTORNEYS

12:37

I'M NOT?

12:38

>> I'M NOT SURE I'M RELATED

12:38

TO A COUPLE.

12:39

YEAH.

12:39

YOU KNOW HE KNOWS HOW THIS

12:41

WORKS RIGHT HERE.

12:42

>> HE PRESUMABLY HE KNOWS

12:45

THE TRICKS.

12:45

>> HE CAN ANTICIPATE WHAT THESE

12:46

LAWYERS ARE GOING TO TRY TO DO.

12:46

AND THEY ALSO SAY AN

12:49

ATTORNEY WHO REPRESENTS HIMSELF

12:49

HAS A CLIENT FOR A FOOL.

12:50

AND THAT ARROGANT, I THINK

12:53

OF KNOWING YOU'RE AN ATTORNEY.

12:54

AND I WILL PUT MY HAND UP FIRST

12:56

AS WELL AS ONE OF THOSE

12:56

PEOPLE IS LIKE, YEAH, I CAN

12:57

PROBABLY OUTSMART MOST

12:59

PEOPLE TRY TO CROSS-EXAMINE ME,

12:59

BUT IN MY ATTEMPT TO DO THAT,

13:00

DON'T TOO HAPPY ABOUT THIS.

13:03

I THINK MY ARROGANCE AND MY

13:04

ANGER MAY COME OUT.

13:06

SO IT'S NOT NECESSARILY IF

13:07

I THINK I'M WINNING OR

13:08

THE ATTORNEY THINKS

13:08

HE'S WINNING, IT'S THE

13:10

PERCEPTION THAT THE JURY HAS.

13:11

AND YOU DON'T WANT TO HAVE

13:12

TWO ATTORNEYS GOING BACK AND

13:13

FORTH AT EACH OTHER BECAUSE

13:13

AT THE END OF THE DAY,

13:16

THE ATTORNEY REPRESENTING

13:17

DONALD TRUMP IS THE ONE WHO'S

13:17

HAVING THEIR CREDIBILITY

13:18

EVALUATED BY THE JURY.

13:20

IT'S MICHAEL COHEN.

13:21

SO IT HELPS.

13:24

BUT I'VE SEEN THE GOVERNMENT

13:25

GO THE WRONG WAY AS WELL.

13:25

>> AND CATHERINE, IT LOOKS LIKE

13:26

THEY'RE GETTING READY TO RESUME

13:28

THIS TESTIMONY NOW.

13:29

>> YEAH, IT DOES.

13:32

LOOKS LIKE THEY'RE COMING

13:33

BACK IN THERE, RETURNING TO THE

13:33

COURTROOM AFTER THE BREAK,

13:35

COHEN IS SEATED ON THE WITNESS

13:36

STAND.

13:36

OUR TEAM, AT LEAST INSIDE SAYS

13:39

THAT TRUMP WAS CONFERRING

13:39

WITH HIS LEAD ATTORNEY,

13:40

TODD BLANCHE, WHEN COHEN

13:43

REENTERED THE COURTROOM.

13:44

SO, OF COURSE, WE WILL SEE.

13:47

WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?

13:48

BUT HE IS ON THE WITNESS STAND,

13:48

SO I THINK WE'LL HAVE SOME NEWS

13:49

OUT OF THIS.

13:49

PRETTY SOON, DIANE.

13:51

>> ALL RIGHT.

13:52

WE'LL BE WATCHING.

13:52

JOHN SANTUCCI,

13:52

KATHERINE FAULDERS,

13:53

BRIAN BUCKMIRE YOU ALL.

13:54

AND WE WILL BE COVERING THIS

13:55

TRIAL ALL DAY LONG.

13:56

WE'L

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