What Makes a Great Basketball Player? | LeBron James & JJ Redick | Full Episode

first of all dude I'm so excited to have

this conversation like fun it's going to

be fun um it's going to be

fun I just want to before we

start I want to make sure we're on the

same page with like why we're doing this

right thank you

um I think it like the core it's got to

be what nothing else is which is we're

celebrating the gang y right so I think

overall like I want it to feel

comfortable relaxed I want it to strike

a very positive tone um I typically rant

about things I'm going to probably rant

today like I it it just comes out

naturally like

whatever let's do

[Music]

it welcome to M the game with LeBron

James and JJ reck this is a new podcast

presented by uninterrupted and 342

Productions I want to be clear here this

is a basketball show this is a show with

the intention and purpose to celebrate

the game promote the game explain the

game uh we will be covering a number of

topics not just the NBA NCAA men's and

women's WNBA

feba uh Lebron and I are two people who

I would call us obsessed with the game

of basketball with this sport that has

given so much to us and two weeks ago we

sat down in LA to record the first two

episodes the first episode actually

asked a simple question what makes a

great basketball player Beyond just

talent and skill set and we touch on a

number of things that we think that we

think make a great basketball player

this is about creating

separation once you get to the highest

levels Everybody Has Talent everybody

has skill how do you separate yourself

one of the things we talk about is

basketball intelligence in some ways

it's a nod to the title of the show and

we posit the question can You Learn

Basketball intelligence can you learn

and develop basketball IQ or is it an

eight and I would argue of course you

can of course you can develop basketball

intelligence through film study through

great coaching and of course through the

number one teacher

experience and I think that's an

important thing to note I was fortunate

to play 15 years in the NBA it was a it

was a hard 15 years of being a plumber

but I had a great experience and I

learned so much about the game and I had

great coaches and I had great teammates

LeBron of course has played the game at

the highest level for 21 years his

experience is valuable his basketball IQ

is valuable one thing to note if you are

listening to this podcast uh we also

have a video podcast available on social

and YouTube and in those videos we will

be showing the exact basketball Concepts

that we are talking about episode one

actually has uh a few different

basketball Concepts that we talk about

episode two is a little more granular a

little more EXO uh but episode one we do

talk about thumb down what is thumb down

thumb down is simply a high screen and

roll a high pick and roll uh thumb down

angle which LeBron references is just

when that pick and roll is angled to a

side of the floor so it's not in the

center of the floor it's either in that

left High quadrant or that right High

quadrant closer to the sideline so thumb

down angle would simply be a ball

handler with the ball a player in either

Corner another player in the high

quadrant opposite the ball and then the

screener and again these two guys can

play Pick and role and you play out of

that by the way a lot of teams call High

pick and roll something different not

every team calls it thumb down I know

when I played for Stan Van Gundy and the

Orlando Magic we had thumb down which

was a high screen en roll with the

fiveman the center we also had a screen

and roll called thumb up which was with

the fourman LeBron by the way will

reference X4 and X5 some teams call the

fourman X4 some teams just call them

four some teams call the fiveman X5 some

teams call the fiveman just five horns

chest is another play that we talk about

horns chest is when two offensive

players are in both corners and then two

offensive players are directly above the

elbow or free throw line area at the

three-point line creating almost like a

horns and then the point guard plays off

of that so the point guard can dribble

off either side the point guard can also

throw the ball to one of the players at

the horns and they can get into

screening action this is horns very

simple ball handler player in either

corner and then two players up here a

lot of times this guy will be the

fiveman this guy will be the ball

handler and this guy will be the scorer

or the shooter Boston Celtics by the way

when they run their horns action a lot

of times the fiveman is space to one of

these corners and they involve Jaylen

Brown Jason Tatum and either Drew

holiday or Derek white horns chest is a

very simple play so let's say this is

LeBron and this is

D'Angelo right here and this is the X5

this is the fiveman D'Angelo would

dribble off of a LeBron screen right

here and then the fivan would then set a

chest screen or a flare screen for

LeBron to this side and that's

ultimately where the ball would go

another play we talk about is floppy

which is a play that I ran all the time

I'm not actually sure why it's called

floppy I do know that the visual for

floppy was this so I think floppy means

you can basically go to either side

floppy is when a catch and shoot

offensive player goes underneath the

basket and there's two bigs one on

either side that can screen for him and

he looks to come off of screens on

either side and catch and shoot the ball

this is just a simple floppy action so

you have the two bigs let's say this is

the fiveman this is the fourman this is

the point guard and then you have the

two Wing players underneath the basket

and let's say the two is the shooter he

can come off either side for a catch and

shoot he could also so come off the

fiveman catch and shoot and honestly

this is going to get a little

discombobulated I know when I played

with Matt Barnes and Philly we would

just dance in circles in here and then

I'd shoot out one of these sides when I

think about the game of

basketball I regard it as so important I

care for it I love it I want to pay

attention to it I want to learn more

about it the game is constantly

evolving and hopefully these discussions

and conversations that LeBron and I have

sometimes with other basketball players

and basketball people hopefully we can

do that hopefully we can teach and

explain and celebrate hopefully we can

mind the

[Music]

game what' you bring well we're going to

start off I brought two bottles chamon

2012 I brought this this is special my

first championship year very special to

me so uh it's a good vintage in burgundy

very very good vintage and then Lynch

BOS uh 95 I just brought that just feel

like that's a nice little Aftershock but

I'm going to open the 2012 chambertin

and then we could just that's okay I

it's more than okay with me I heard you

was a wine guy too so well I I told you

this we were originally supposed to

record this first sit down in New York

so in anticipation of that I actually

brought three bottles of 89 l w Ro to

the office and obviously some things

came up we didn't make it work so that's

a great Sound by the way we were both on

the same page we were both on the same

page which I love um it's funny I I

called your game Wednesday night uh

against the Clippers you had just an

insane fourth quarter and I was talking

about as it relates to you competitive

stamina which is simply the ability to

do something at a high level and then

get up the next day and do it again and

for you that's happened season after

season year after year I think the best

players have a level of competitive

stamina and it's one of three qualities

for me that make a great basketball

player cuz your quote after the game it

was I know I was born with some gifts

and athletic abilities but that only

gets you so far for sure what are the

qualities for you that make a great

basketball player Beyond just talent and

skill set and

size um knowing the history of the

game knowing the history of the game

knowing the ones that came before you

knowing the ones that paved the way

knowing the reason why you're

actually having the ability to actually

live out your

dream that doesn't happen without the

people that came before you it doesn't

happen without Bill Russell you know

going through what he went through

during the Civil Rights Movement and all

those things Oscar Robinson going on

with what he had to deal with you know

during those times it does not happen if

they're able to just be pure and who

they are that allows us to now perform

and do it with no care

um also I think discipline

at people you know what people use that

word so loosely

what does it mean to

you you have

to have the ability when you when it

comes to discipline it's like you have

to sacrifice loved

ones you have to sacrifice loved ones

for a long period of time if you want to

be great it is very unfortunate and you

feel it at times you you know you know

the saying if if if the if it's too hot

get the hell out of the kitchen yeah

sometimes you just got to get out of the

kitchen cuz it gets hot but you have to

have a discipline to sometimes you have

to sacrifice loved ones in order to be

great because they don't

understand and and that's okay they

don't understand what it means to like I

am getting up every single day at 5 or

6:

a.m. and when I get home after everyone

leaves the gym I'm going to take a nap

so now you're sacrificing your loved

ones cuz you're not spending time with

them and when I wake up I'm probably

going to train again and then I'm going

to have dinner and then I'm going to bed

and I'm going to do that every single

day for a long period of time that's

sacrificing and discipline you know and

for me I was 18 when I came into the

league so I got my best friends from

high school that's now in college I got

one that's at Ohio State I got two

that's at the University of arran I have

another one that's at a school in West

Virginia uh Fairmont State and they're

calling me telling me uh Hey Oho you got

y you got to come down to the you got to

come down to these parties you're not

going to college you're never going to

be in college you

got and I I couldn't do

it I couldn't do it I look back on it

now I wish I would have done a few of

them not going to

lie I'm not gonna lie I wish I did um

but then the third thing JJ

asked do you really love the

game like do you really love the game

and I'm not just talking about like wins

and losses do you really love the

process of the game and everything that

happens

before the referee does like this that's

the easy part you noce you notice you

was one of the first ones in the gym one

of the last ones to leave everyone sees

when the cameras are rolling and the

20,000 fans are there and the

cheerleaders are dancing and the popcorn

is popping and the celebrities are

sitting in Celebrity role but like who

has the love for the game when nobody is

there you know I love all of that and

it's interesting the Love of the Game

part is so funny to me because I think

there's a there's a distinction M

between loving the game IE the game the

actual competition itself and what it

means to actually love the game and

everything that goes into that you hear

guys all the time I just want to play I

just want to play okay do you want to do

all the things that are

necessary that lead up to playing the

actual game well the guys that say I

just want to play won't they they their

career won't be long yeah because

they're not going to put in all the

other all the intricate parts of what to

get to that point that's only going to

it's not going to last that long it's

not going to last that long you won't

have a a long sustainable career and and

that's okay some some guys I I mean

you've been a locker room some guys

don't really care about playing a long

time in this league or or having a

sustain you have so sometimes I I look

in like some of the All-Star locker

rooms I've been in and you see a guy one

year or you see a guy maybe two years

and then he's he's not in the locker

room anymore after that and you just

like Wonder to yourself why you know you

don't know you don't know if it's the

max contract that he got after he made

the All-Star team you don't know if if

now they know him by one name for one

summer you know you just don't know but

it's like if you want to if you want to

be great and want to be like legendary

or not even I don't even say

that if you want to maximize everything

that you

have with your career and your

ability then squeeze the [ __ ] out of

that limit yeah why not yeah I want I

want to talk about each of those three

things uh little in depth because I also

have three things but the history of the

game part's interesting to me because

you brought up Oscar Robertson M and

whether the Casual fan knows this or not

Oscar Robertson sued in 1970 for free

agency and that court case took six

years so the NBA really didn't have any

form of free agency until 1976 side note

in

1977 at the time in free agency you had

to compensate the team that was losing

the player mhm so Gail Goodrich left the

Los Angeles

Lakers and went to the

Jazz the Jazz compensated the Lakers

with some future draft picks one of

those picks turned out to be magic johs

be magic it's pretty interesting um you

talked about the discipline is pretty

interesting that's pretty cool though I

like it's like soccer now yeah yeah it's

like soccer you got to Club there wasn't

real unrestricted free agency John conak

was the first guy and that was like 1987

right it just didn't exist right the

reason I mean I didn't make as much

money as you but the reason I got to

make a lot of money in the NBA is like

it's a direct line to Oscar Roberts yeah

for sure you know let's let's celebrate

that right you talked about the the

sacrificing loved ones I always felt

like my Pursuit was so selfish yeah and

I would acknowledge that to my wife my

kids whatever my friends it was so

selfish it was like the only way that I

knew how to do it the only way that's it

so you touched on those things uh my

three things are competitive stamina

which I'm going to get to in a second

the Love of the Game is one of mine for

sure caring more about your craft

instead of the other stuff that doesn't

matter is a direct quote from you for

sure uh and then the third one I think

is basketball IQ yeah basketball

IQ I have

described nicoa yic I've described you

as having uh supercomputers like your

processing speed is a little different I

put James hard in that category I put

Luke in that category there's there's a

number of guys that have like a

different processing speed some of this

stuff Love of the Game that's a little

bit of just desire attitude all that

stuff competitive stamina same thing y

can you develop basketball IQ at the

highest level you can get a little

smarter as a player can you develop it

as a fun while you was while when you

brought up basketball IQ I was start the

first thing that came to my mind I

started thinking right away I was

like are you are you born with

basketball IQ or are you taught the game

the right way and now the basketball IQ

clicks on like I was literally just when

you was explaining that because I come

from I come from I believe great

coaching you know from my literally

Coach Frank Walker senior to my at the

time a coach uh coach Drew Joyce to my

high school coach who was a former

college coach coach Dan bro and then my

a coach took over when coach dber I went

back to college

basketball I'm thinking to myself I'm

like I I I was taught the game the right

way um but the one thing that a those

coaches always told me they they told me

that I had a an an uncanny ability to

process information faster than anyone

they've ever seen

one coach and this is I know you're

going to you're going to smirk about

this there's guys in the

NBA that if you call a play or coach

draw a play to one side of the

floor they can't switch it in their head

and do it and say let's run it to the

other side yeah without the coach

drawing on the clipboard yeah I've never

understood that and I don't know I never

understood that so if I say we running

we running thumb down angle we're

running on the right side so cuz I have

a left-hand point guard he wants to come

middle to a strong hand he has the

ability to hit the pocket pass with the

left hand has the ability to throw ahead

he's Lefty and also has the ability to

throw back on the

shake but if I say hey we running thumb

down angle on the left side because now

the right hand guard coming

right I've had teammates that's like oh

what do you what do you mean coaches

always every in practice we only ran it

from this side

yeah I I could flip a play when I was 8

years

old no matter if it was just passing cut

no matter if it was let's run flex but

let's start on the left side no matter

if it was just you know let's dho dho

dho driving kick the last one all right

now let's let's just drive the Baseline

Baseline Drive drift if the GU the B if

the if the if the forward on the left

side's looking at the ball you can slot

cut I could that I was doing that stuff

when I was like 8 n years old and and my

coaches would just be blown away and I

would just I wouldn't know where it came

from I have no idea so to get back to

your question I think I was born with a

sports

IQ and it could have been any sport but

I just think basketball was the one that

I like I

was I chose and maybe I was chosen to do

that as well and I just took it to a

whole as I got older and your mind gets

you start to you start to live it you

start to want to be a part of it you

start watching I started to watch the I

start watching the games you know when I

was like 19 years old I when I first

started I was watching just a fan I was

just a fan of Michael Jordan and Anthony

Penny Hardway and Grant Hill and you

know those guys I was just a fan but

then when I started playing the game I

actually started like studying what

those guys were doing on on the floor

and what teams were doing how teams were

guarding how coaches were coaching you

know sub and patterns you know time of

possession you know one thing that kills

me JJ in our

league I'm G tell you what kills me tell

me tell me what kills

you the two for one shot at the end of

quarters are you going uh on a anti-

crusade against the two for one I

understand why the two for one is

important obviously it's numbers you get

two possessions the other team gets one

possession in theory it's a fre shot in

theory it's a free

shot but what people sometimes don't

account for the four or five possessions

before

that are we on a run are we on a heater

have we gotten a good shot over the last

two and a half minutes what is the other

team doing how are are they in a great

Rhythm if we haven't gotten a great shot

in two and a half three minutes and

we've been turning the ball over why am

I just going to dribble down and shoot a

40-footer with 33 on the clock why not

get a look cuz that great look at the

end of the third even if we get one shot

may give us momentum going into the

fourth

quarter right you know it's interesting

because I think it does [ __ ] with the

flow of the game and as a player I felt

that as a a broadcaster now where I'm

calling games you can you have such a

good feel as like an outside Observer

yeah of this action happening

so end of the second quarter you're

going going into halftime with the lead

you've established let's say a pick and

roll partnership where you're getting a

good shot every time down the floor on

the other end you're getting

stops you're getting stops the other

team's having why are you you're right

why are you gonna just jack up a

35-footer just go to the pick and roll

rely on your defense now boom you go

into the half with essentially the same

momentum you would have if you get the

two for one yeah by the way you shouted

out your coaches I I I want to say this

because I think there some of it is in

eight with basketball I yeah yeah some

of it is the way you're taught some of

it is going back to your point about

discipline the dedication to the craft I

gotta I gotta shout out my coaches now

because delmare Irving Keith Haynes dick

wall my early coaches for The Rono

Jaguars yeah they taught me how to play

they taught me how to play with

toughness I get to Jun uh JV 8th grade

Chris Morris y Billy Hicks then I go to

Coach K at Duke yeah so by the time I

got to the NBA I knew how to process and

think the game it wasn't new to me it

wasn't new to me to think the game you

also knew what was [ __ ] and what and

what was not [ __ ] yes there's a lot

of [ __ ] that gets taught in our

league

because our league has been feast off

potential guys with potential they come

in and say this guy has potential we

have to

if it's not year one maybe year two or

not year three or maybe year four or we

going to pick up his option in year four

like it's been it's been grasped on

potential like that has

been that's the whole thing of the

lottery the whole thing of the lottery

pick one through 13 or 14 I don't even

know what it is now when it cuts off

like you've been a lottery

pick but it makes sense why those guys

that's like 16 to 30 16 to 42 why those

guys be on real contending teams making

impacts also why is it the same teams

that always draft

well and the same teams that always

draft poorly I'll tell you when I get my

team the teams that draft well those

guys will be working for me for sure

just you to offer him a bag yeah for

sure you got to getok OKC does an

unbelievable job with that that's a fact

that's a fact I was thinking about you

know this so by like the end of my first

year with the Clippers mhm re realized

all of my catch and shoot stuff I wanted

to come over left shoulder yes sir right

I wanted to come to my right yes sir and

so for the next three years every single

time we drew up a play was to do that

right when I got to like Philly to your

point about like guys not understanding

this I got to like Philly and New

Orleans the coaches would drop a play in

the Huddle and I'd be like n no no I

want to come over my left shoulder just

flip it and I'd walk out on the court

and then my teammates would be like oh

what am I what am I doing here you know

what I mean I'm like no no just just

flip it which guys by the way the the

the the processing speed I mentioned a

few guys guys you played with guys you

played against yeah that you think have

that sort of highlevel basketball IQ uh

ran Rondo yeah for sure he has he can

process flip do things on the on the go

like it's very weird to me that he's not

coaching at a high level I think it's

because he doesn't want to do it it's a

lot

it is a lot it is a lot who wants to

deal with all these rich entitled guys

all the time it's you guys make too much

money it's just a weird thing you guys

make too much it's just a weird let's

get a cheers man let's get a cheers man

Cheers Cheers thank you for the wine by

the way it smells amazing

too um going back to that competitive

stand of thing cuz I I was calling the

game and I knew this CU I played in LA

but Clippers home games against the

Lakers is not really a home game half

the crowd are Clippers fans half the

crowd are Lakers fans and so the arena

felt very subdued you know cuz you guys

were getting your ass kicked getting our

ass kicked the body language was bad I