May 12 — Sec. Blinken, Sens. Bernie Sanders and Lindsey Graham

NBC News
12 May 202447:40

Summary

TLDRIn a recent episode of 'Meet the Press', the discussion revolved around the escalating conflict between Israel and Palestine, with a focus on President Biden's warning to Israel about potential cuts to American weapons supply. The show featured a range of guests, including Secretary of State Antony Blinken, Senator Lindsay Graham, and Independent Senator Bernie Sanders, who shared their perspectives on the crisis. Blinken defended the State Department's report on the conflict, emphasizing the complexity of the situation and the importance of Israel's self-policing. Sanders criticized Israel's actions, arguing for a halt to U.S. military aid, while Graham staunchly supported Israel, equating the conflict's urgency to historical attacks like Hiroshima and 9/11. The program also touched on the potential political implications of the conflict on President Biden's administration and the upcoming 2024 election.

Takeaways

  • 🚨 President Biden has warned Israel that the U.S. will cut off some American weapons if Israel launches a full-scale assault in the city of Rafah, where over 1 million Palestinians are sheltering.
  • 🛡️ Israel has responded defiantly, stating they are willing to fight without U.S. help if necessary, emphasizing their resolve to defeat Hamas, including in Rafah.
  • 💣 The U.S. administration has already halted a large shipment of 2,500 bombs to Israel, and President Biden has admitted that U.S.-supplied bombs have killed civilians in Gaza.
  • 🕊️ There is a call for an immediate ceasefire from the American people, with opposition to more U.S. military aid going to the conflict.
  • 🤔 Tensions are high, with questions about whether the relationship between the U.S. and Israel is at a crisis point.
  • 👎 A judge in Donald Trump's criminal trial has threatened jail time if Trump violates a gag order again, after ruling that Trump violated it ten times.
  • 📉 Despite the threats, the State Department has not reached a definitive conclusion on whether Israel has violated international law, leading to criticism from various sectors.
  • 📈 Senator Lindsay Graham strongly opposes President Biden's threat to withhold military aid to Israel, arguing it would weaken Israel's hand against Hamas.
  • 🏛️ There is a debate within the U.S. about the effectiveness of using military aid as leverage to influence Israeli policy, with references to past presidents' actions.
  • 🏊 Michael Phelps, the most decorated Olympian of all time, has opened up about his battle with depression, highlighting the importance of mental health awareness.
  • 💰 The Biden campaign is planning high-profile fundraisers with celebrities and former presidents to boost campaign funds and build infrastructure for the upcoming election.

Q & A

  • What warning did President Biden issue regarding American weapons to Israel?

    -President Biden warned Israel that he would cut off some American weapons if the Israeli military launches a full-scale assault inside the city of Rafah, where more than 1 million Palestinians are sheltering.

  • How did Israel respond to President Biden's warning?

    -Israel responded defiantly, stating that they are willing to fight without U.S. help if necessary and that they will stand alone if required.

  • What is the U.S. State Department's stance on Israel's actions in Gaza?

    -The State Department released a report criticizing Israel for failing to protect civilians in Gaza and raising substantial questions about Israel's compliance with international humanitarian law.

  • What has been the American public's response to the conflict?

    -The American people have called for an immediate ceasefire and have expressed their disapproval of more U.S. military aid going to the conflict.

  • What is the current state of the U.S.-Israel relationship?

    -The relationship between the U.S. and Israel is at a critical point due to disagreements over military actions in Gaza and the potential withholding of U.S. weapons.

  • What is the position of Senator Bernie Sanders regarding U.S. military aid to Israel?

    -Senator Bernie Sanders believes that Israel should not receive any more U.S. military aid, citing the destruction caused in Gaza and the breaking of international law.

  • What is the position of Senator Lindsay Graham regarding U.S. military aid to Israel?

    -Senator Lindsay Graham is opposed to President Biden's threat to withhold military aid to Israel, arguing that it is necessary for Israel to fight against Hamas and that the U.S. should fully support Israel.

  • What is the U.S.'s reported action regarding a shipment of bombs to Israel?

    -The U.S. has reportedly halted a large shipment of 2,500 bombs to Israel, with President Biden warning that the pause could extend to even more weapons.

  • What is the reported number of Palestinians killed by Israeli forces according to the Hamas-controlled Gaza Ministry?

    -The Hamas-controlled Gaza Ministry reports that Israeli forces have killed over 6,000 Palestinians, including 2,700 children.

  • What is the U.S.'s reported action regarding the release of hostages and ceasefire?

    -The U.S., through the CIA Director's involvement, has been engaged in efforts to secure the release of hostages and to negotiate a ceasefire.

  • What is the reported impact of the conflict on the civilian population in Gaza?

    -The conflict has reportedly led to the destruction of 60% of housing in Gaza, a systematic destruction of the healthcare system, and the likelihood of hundreds of thousands of children facing starvation.

Outlines

00:00

😀 Biden's Warning to Israel on Weapon Supply

President Biden has warned Israel that the U.S. will cease supplying certain weapons if Israel proceeds with a full-scale assault on Rafah, a city in Gaza with over a million Palestinians. This warning comes amidst a broader conflict where Israel has shown defiance, stating they are prepared to fight without U.S. aid if necessary. The U.S.'s stance has evolved from previous approaches, with Biden acknowledging civilian casualties as a consequence of U.S.-supplied bombs. Despite this, the U.S. has not completely halted arms shipments to Israel, leading to domestic pressure and questions about the integrity of the U.S.-Israel relationship.

05:02

😐 U.S. State Department's Report on Israel's Actions

The U.S. State Department has released a report that criticizes Israel for not protecting civilians in Gaza, raising questions about potential violations of international law. However, the report does not come to a definitive conclusion about Israel's compliance with international humanitarian law. Secretary of State Antony Blinken defends the report, stating that the U.S. does not apply double standards and that Israel, like any other country, is assessed based on its compliance with the law. Blinken also discusses the complexity of the military situation and the difficulty of making a definitive assessment in real-time.

10:02

😟 Civilian Casualties and the Aftermath of War

Concerns are raised about the potential civilian casualties and the lack of a clear plan for the aftermath of the war in Gaza. Secretary Blinken acknowledges the difficulty of assessing the situation in real-time and emphasizes the importance of credible plans for civilians. He also addresses the potential long-term issues, such as the persistence of armed Hamas fighters and the risk of creating a power vacuum that could lead to further instability.

15:04

😠 Senator Graham's Defense of Israel and Criticism of Biden's Stance

Senator Lindsay Graham strongly criticizes President Biden's threat to withhold military aid to Israel if it invades Rafah. Graham argues that it is impossible to mitigate civilian deaths in Gaza as long as Hamas uses human shields. He also condemns the idea of restricting weapons to Israel, calling it a dangerous and irresponsible move. Graham emphasizes the importance of supporting Israel against what he perceives as an existential threat and criticizes those who suggest withholding aid.

20:06

😔 Senator Sanders' Critique of U.S. Support for Israel

Senator Bernie Sanders expresses his belief that Israel has broken international and American law and should not receive further U.S. military aid. He describes the impact of the conflict on Palestinian civilians, including the destruction of housing and infrastructure, and the potential for widespread starvation among children. Sanders also discusses the potential political implications of the conflict for President Biden, suggesting that the war in Gaza could be politically damaging, akin to the Vietnam War for previous administrations.

25:07

😕 The Impact of U.S. Policy on the Israel-Hamas Conflict

The panel discusses the implications of U.S. policy on the Israel-Hamas conflict, including the potential impact on the upcoming election and the influence of celebrity endorsements in fundraising. They also touch on the legal battles involving former President Trump and the potential effect on moderate and independent voters. The conversation highlights the complexities of the U.S.'s role in international conflicts and domestic politics.

Mindmap

Keywords

💡Red Line

A 'red line' refers to a limit or condition that, if crossed or met, will prompt a specific response or action. In the context of the video, President Biden warns that if Israel launches a full-scale assault inside the city of Rafah, he will not supply certain American weapons historically used to deal with Rafah. This sets a condition for the continuation of military aid.

💡Rafah

Rafah is a city in the southern part of the Gaza Strip, which is a densely populated area with over a million Palestinians sheltering there. The city is significant in the video as the potential site of a full-scale Israeli military operation, which would have severe humanitarian consequences and is a point of contention in U.S.-Israeli relations.

💡Civilian Casualties

Civilian casualties refer to the unintended harm or death of non-combatants during military operations. The video discusses concerns over the potential for increased civilian casualties in Rafah should Israel proceed with a major military operation, highlighting the ethical and strategic dilemmas faced by both Israel and its allies.

💡International Humanitarian Law

International humanitarian law (IHL) is the set of rules that aim to protect people who are not or are no longer participating in the hostilities during armed conflicts. The video mentions the U.S. State Department's report suggesting that Israel may have violated IHL in Gaza, which raises questions about the legality of its actions and the potential withholding of military aid.

💡Hamas

Hamas is a Palestinian Islamic fundamentalist and militant organization that controls the Gaza Strip. In the video, Hamas is portrayed as a terrorist organization that poses a significant threat to Israel and is the adversary in the current conflict. The discussion revolves around the Israeli objective of preventing Hamas from governing Gaza.

💡Weapon Withhold

Weapon withhold refers to the act of stopping the supply of weapons to a party involved in a conflict. President Biden's warning to withhold certain U.S. weapons if Israel proceeds with operations in Rafah is a central point in the video, indicating a shift in U.S. policy and a means of exerting diplomatic pressure.

💡Humanitarian Aid

Humanitarian aid involves the provision of assistance aimed at relieving suffering and maintaining the well-being of civilians affected by conflict or disaster. The video discusses the urgent need for humanitarian aid in Gaza, where the civilian population is facing dire conditions due to the ongoing conflict.

💡Military Aid

Military aid is the provision of military resources, such as weapons, training, or financial assistance, to another country. The video focuses on the U.S.'s consideration to withhold military aid to Israel, which is a significant point of debate and reflects the tension in the U.S.-Israel relationship.

💡State Department Report

The State Department report is a document produced by the U.S. Department of State that assesses various international issues. In the video, the report criticizes Israel for failing to protect civilians in Gaza and raises questions about potential violations of international law, which is a pivotal aspect of the discussion on U.S. policy towards the conflict.

💡Gaza

Gaza is a self-governing Palestinian territory with a dense population, located along the eastern coast of the Mediterranean Sea. The video discusses the conflict in Gaza, particularly the impact of Israeli military operations on the civilian population and infrastructure, and the international response to the crisis.

💡Palestinians

Palestinians are an ethnic group with historical ties to the region of Palestine, which includes areas of modern-day Israel, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip. The video highlights the plight of Palestinians in Gaza, who are significantly affected by the ongoing conflict with Israel.

Highlights

President Biden warns Israel that the U.S. will cut off some American weapons if a full-scale assault is launched in Rafah, a densely populated area with over 1 million Palestinians.

Israel responds defiantly, stating they are willing to fight without U.S. help if necessary.

U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken discusses the complexity of the situation and the challenges in assessing compliance with international humanitarian law.

Blinken emphasizes that Israel has the means and will to police itself, with open inquiries and criminal investigations into specific incidents.

The State Department report criticizes Israel for failing to protect civilians in Gaza and raises questions about potential violations of international law.

Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu expresses preparedness to act alone in protecting Israel's future and defeating Hamas.

Senator Bernie Sanders argues that Israel has broken international and American law and should not receive further U.S. military aid.

Senator Lindsay Graham strongly opposes Biden's threat to withhold military aid, emphasizing the importance of supporting Israel against Hamas.

Graham suggests that withholding weapons from Israel could embolden its enemies and put civilians at greater risk.

The panel discusses the potential political implications of Biden's decision on military aid within the Democratic party and the upcoming election.

Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps opens up about his battle with depression, highlighting the importance of vulnerability and change.

The Biden campaign is focusing on fundraising with the help of high-profile celebrities to bolster support in battleground states.

Former President Trump's legal battles, including the recent testimony of Michael Cohen, are seen as potentially alienating moderate voters.

The panel debates whether the U.S. leveraging military aid to influence Israel's policy is effective or undermines Israel's security.

Senator Graham calls for unconditional support for Israel, arguing against the idea of withholding aid during a time of existential threat.

The discussion touches on the potential impact of the Israel-Hamas conflict on the Saudi normalization deal and the broader Middle East strategy.

Senator Graham insists that the U.S. should not let political considerations dictate the support for Israel's fight against Hamas.

Transcripts

00:07

00:07

00:08

>>> THIS SUNDAY, BIDEN'S RED

00:11

LINE.

00:12

PRESIDENT BIDEN WARNS ISRAEL HE

00:13

WILL CUT OFF SOME AMERICAN

00:15

WEAPONS IF THE ISRAELI MILITARY

00:17

LAUNCHES A FULL-SCALE ASSAULT

00:19

INSIDE THE CITY OF RAFAH WHERE

00:22

MORE THAN 1 MILLION PALESTINIANS

00:24

ARE SHELTERING.

00:25

>> IF THEY GO INTO RAFAH I'M NOT

00:28

SUPPLYING THE WEAPONS THAT HAVE

00:30

BEEN USED HISTORICALLY TO DEAL

00:31

WITH RAFAH.

00:33

>> ISRAEL DEFIANT SAYING THEY

00:35

ARE WILLING TO FIGHT WITHOUT

00:36

U.S. HELP.

00:37

>> IF ISRAEL HAS TO STAND ALONE,

00:39

WE'LL STAND ALONE.

00:40

>> GIVE ISRAEL WHAT THEY NEED TO

00:42

FIGHT THE WAR THEY CAN'T AFFORD

00:43

TO LOSE.

00:44

>> THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WANT AN

00:47

IMMEDIATE CEASEFIRE AND THEY DO

00:50

NOT WANT MORE U.S. MILITARY AID

00:52

GOING TO THE WAR MACHINE.

00:54

>> IS THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN

00:56

THE U.S. AND ISRAEL AT A CRISIS

00:57

POINT?

00:58

MY GUEST THIS MORNING SECRETARY

01:00

OF STATE ANTONY BLINKEN,

01:02

REPUBLICAN SENATOR LINDSAY GHLAM

01:05

OF SOUTH CAROLINA AND

01:07

INDEPENDENT SENATOR BERN SANDERS

01:08

OF VERMONT.

01:09

PLUS LEGAL STORM.

01:11

AFTER RULING DONALD TRUMP

01:13

VIOLATED A GAG ORDER TEN TIMES

01:15

THE JUDGE PRESIDING OVER TRUMP'S

01:17

CRIMINAL TRIAL THREATENS JAIL

01:19

TIME IF HE VIOLATES THE GAG

01:20

ORDER AGAIN.

01:21

>> IF YOU SAY ANYTHING SLIGHTLY

01:23

OFF HE WANTS TO PUT YOU IN JAIL.

01:25

>> AND AFTER STORMY DANIELS

01:27

TAKES THE STAND DESCRIBING HER

01:29

SEXUAL ENCOUNTER WITH MR. TRUMP

01:31

THE JUDGE REJECTS THE DEFENSE

01:33

TEAM'S REQUEST FOR A MISTRIAL.

01:35

JOINING ME FOR INSIGHT AND

01:38

ANALYSIS ARE NBC NEWS WHITE

01:41

HOUSE CORRESPONDENT MONICA ALBA,

01:41

FORMER WHITE HOUSE PRESS

01:43

SECRETARY JEN PSAKI AND STEPHEN

01:46

HAYES EDITOR OF "THE DISPATCH."

01:47

WELCOME TO SUNDAY.

01:49

IT'S "MEET THE PRESS."

01:51

>>> FROM NBC NEWS IN WASHINGTON

01:54

THE LONGEST-RUNNING SHOW IN

01:55

TELEVISION HISTORY, THIS IS

01:56

"MEET THE PRESS" WITH KRISTEN

01:59

WELKER.

02:00

>>> GOOD SUNDAY MORNING AND

02:02

HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY.

02:04

TODAY THE WORLD'S EYES ARE ON

02:07

GAZA AS THE ISRAELI MILITARY

02:09

WIDENS OPERATIONS INCLUDING

02:10

ORDERING MORE EVACUATIONS FROM

02:12

PARTS OF RAFAH, A DENSELY

02:15

POPULATED AREA IN SOUTHERN GAZA

02:17

DESPITE PRESIDENT BIDEN'S STARK

02:18

WARNING THAT HE'LL WITHHOLD

02:20

WEAPONS IF THEY LAUNCH A MAJOR

02:21

OPERATION.

02:22

THE U.N. SAYS 300,000 PEOPLE

02:25

HAVE FLED RAFAH OVER THE LAST

02:26

WEEK.

02:27

NOW LAST WEEK THE WHITE HOUSE

02:32

HALTED A LARGE SHIPMENT OF 2,500

02:37

BOMBS TO ISRAEL.

02:38

PRESIDENT BIDEN WARNED THE PAUSE

02:39

COULD EXTEND TO EVEN MORE

02:41

WEAPONS EVEN THOUGH THE

02:43

ADMINISTRATION SENDS SMALLER

02:44

ARMS AND IT'S THE BIGGEST BREAK

02:46

WITH THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT AND

02:48

MR. BIDEN MADE A STRIKING

02:50

ADMISSION THAT BOMBS SUPPLIED BY

02:52

THE U.S. HAVE KILLED CIVILIANS

02:53

IN GAZA.

02:54

>> CIVILIANS HAVE BEEN KILLED IN

02:56

GAZA AS A CONSEQUENCE OF THOSE

02:58

BOMBS AND OTHER WAYS IN WHICH

03:00

THEY GO AFTER POPULATION CENTERS

03:02

AND LET ME BE CLEAR THAT IF THEY

03:04

GO INTO RAFAH, THEY HAVEN'T GONE

03:06

INTO RAFAH YET, IF THEY GO INTO

03:08

RAFAH I'M NOT SUPPLYING THE

03:10

WEAPONS THAT HAVE BEEN USE

03:12

HISTORICALLY TO DEAL WITH RAFAH,

03:13

TO DEAL WITH THE CITIES.

03:15

>> IT'S A NOTABLE EVOLUTION FROM

03:17

THE WAY THE PRESIDENT TALKS

03:20

ABOUT CIVILIAN DEATHS.

03:22

>> HAMAS CONTROLLED GAZA

03:24

MINISTRY SAYS ISRAELI FORCES

03:26

HAVE KILLED OVER 6,000

03:29

PALESTINIANS INCLUDING 2700

03:30

CHILDREN.

03:30

YOU'VE PREVIOUSLY ASKED

03:33

NETANYAHU TO MINIMIZE CIVILIAN

03:34

CASUALTIES, DO THESE NUMBERS SAY

03:36

TO YOU THAT HE'S IGNORING THAT

03:38

MESSAGE?

03:38

>> MA WHAT THEY SAY TO ME IS

03:41

THAT NO NOTIONS ARE THE

03:44

PALESTINIANS ARE TELLING THE

03:45

TRUTH.

03:46

I'M SURE INNOCENTS HAVE BEEN

03:47

KILLED.

03:48

I THINK WE SHOULD BE INCREDIBLY

03:50

CAREFUL AND I THINK THE ISRAELIS

03:52

SHOULD BE INCREDIBLY CAREFUL,

03:53

BUT I HAVE NO CONFIDENCE IN THE

03:56

NUMBER THAT THE PALESTINIANS ARE

03:56

USING.

03:57

>> ON FRIDAY THE STATE

03:59

DEPARTMENT RELEASED A REPORT

04:01

CRITICIZING ISRAEL FOR FAILING

04:02

TO PROTECT CIVILIANS IN GAZA

04:04

SAYING THE RESULTS ON THE GROUND

04:06

INCLUDING HIGH LEVELS OF

04:08

CIVILIAN CASUALTIES RAISED

04:09

SUBSTANTIAL QUESTIONS.

04:11

THE REPORT SAYS IT IS REASONABLE

04:13

TO ASSESS THAT ISRAEL HAS

04:15

VIOLATED INTERNATIONAL LAW IN

04:16

GAZA, BUT SAID THE U.S. HASN'T

04:18

BEEN ABLE TO VERIFY INSTANCES

04:21

THAT WOULD JUSTIFY WITHHOLDING

04:22

MILITARY AID.

04:23

THAT FINDING ALLOWS THE U.S. TO

04:26

CONTINUE SUPPLYING WEAPONS TO

04:27

ISRAEL.

04:28

RESPONDING TO PRESIDENT BIDEN,

04:29

ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER NETANYAHU

04:30

SAID ISRAEL IS PREPAREDED TO GO

04:33

IT ALONE.

04:35

>> I'VE KNOWN JOE BIDEN FOR MANY

04:38

YEARS, 40 YEARS OR MORE.

04:40

WE OFTEN HAD AGREEMENTS AND

04:42

WE'VE HAD OUR DISAGREEMENTS.

04:43

WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO OVERCOME

04:44

THEM.

04:45

I HOPE WE CAN OVERCOME THEM NOW,

04:47

BUT WE WILL DO WHAT WE HAVE TO

04:49

DO TO PROTECT OUR COUNTRY AND

04:52

THAT MEANS PROTECT OUR FUTURE

04:54

AND THAT MEANS WE WILL DEFEAT

04:56

HAMAS INCLUDING IN RAFAH, WE

04:59

HAVE NO OTHER CHOICE.

05:01

AND JOINING ME NOW IS SECRETARY

05:03

OF STATE ANTONY BLINKEN.

05:05

SECRETARY BLINKEN, WELCOME BACK

05:06

TO "MEET THE PRESS".

05:07

>> GOOD MORNING, KRISTEN.

05:08

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING

05:08

HERE.

05:09

I WANT TO START WITH THAT STATE

05:13

DEPARTMENT REPORT THAT DID NOT

05:15

DRAW A DEFINITIVE CONCLUSION

05:16

ABOUT ISRAEL AND WHETHER IT'S

05:18

VIOLATED INTERNATIONAL LAW.

05:19

AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL SAYS OF

05:21

THE REPORT THIS IS THE, QUOTE,

05:23

INTERNATIONAL VERSION OF SENDING

05:25

THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS.

05:26

DEMOCRATIC SENATOR CHRIS VAN

05:28

HOLLAND SAYS IT DUCKS THE

05:29

ULTIMATE QUESTIONS THAT THE

05:31

REPORT WAS DESIGNED TO

05:32

DETERMINE.

05:34

MR. SECRETARY, IS THE U.S.

05:36

TRYING TO AVOID WITHHOLDING

05:38

ISRAEL ACCOUNTABLE FOR ITS

05:38

ACTIONS?

05:39

>> NO.

05:40

WE DON'T HAVE DOUBLE STANDARDS.

05:43

WE TREATISE RAIL, ONE OF OUR

05:45

CLOSESTAL RYES AND PARTNERS LIKE

05:47

WE WOULD ANY OTHER COUNTRIES

05:49

INCLUDING ASSESSING

05:52

INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN LAW

05:54

AND ITS COMPLIANCE WITH THAT

05:56

LAW.

05:57

THE REPORT ALSO MAKES CLEAR THAT

06:00

THIS IS AN INCREDIBLY COMPLEX

06:02

MILITARY ENVIRONMENT.

06:03

YOU HAVE AN ENEMY THAT EMBEDS

06:06

ITSELF WITH CIVILIANS, HIDING

06:08

UNDER AND WITHIN SCHOOLS,

06:09

MOSQUES, APARTMENT BUILDINGS AND

06:11

FIRING UP ISRAELI FORCES FROM

06:12

THOSE PLACES.

06:13

IT'S VERY, VERY DIFFICULT IN THE

06:16

HEAT OF WAR TO MAKE A DEFINITIVE

06:18

ASSESSMENT ABOUT ANY INDIVIDUAL

06:20

INCIDENT, BUT THE REPORT SAYS

06:21

BASED ON THE TOTALITY OF THE

06:23

HARM THAT'S BEEN DONE TO

06:24

CHILDREN, TO WOMEN, TO MEN WHO

06:27

ARE CAUGHT IN THIS CROSSFIRE

06:28

HAMAS IS MAKING IT'S REASONABLE

06:30

TO CONCLUDE THAT THEIR INSTANCES

06:32

WHERE ISRAEL HAS ACTED IN WAYS

06:35

THAT ARE NOT CONSISTENT WITH

06:37

INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN LAW

06:38

AND WE CONTINUE TO LOOK AT AND

06:40

INVESTIGATE EACH OF THESE

06:42

INCIDENTS, BUT CRITICALLY SO

06:43

DOES ISRAEL.

06:44

THERE ARE UNDERSTANDS, AS WE

06:48

UNDERSTAND IT OF OPEN INQUIRIES

06:51

INTO PARTICULAR INCIDENTS AND

06:53

CRIMINAL INVESTIGATIONS GOING

06:53

FORWARD.

06:54

ISRAEL, UNLIKE MANY OTHER

06:55

COUNTRIES HAS BOTH THE MEANS AND

06:58

THE WILL TO TRY TO POLICE ITSELF

07:00

SO WE NEED TO LET THOSE PLAY

07:02

OUT, BUT OUR OWN PROCESS THAT

07:04

HAS BEEN UNDER WAY FOR MANY

07:08

MONTHS TO LOOK AT INDIVIDUAL

07:11

INCIDENTS WILL CONTINUE AS WELL

07:12

AND WHEN WE CAN REACH DOWN

07:14

COLLUSION, AS WELL AND IT IS

07:16

DIFFICULT TO DO THAT IN THE

07:17

MIDST OF WAR.

07:18

>> HERE WE ARE IN THE SEVENTH

07:20

MONTH OF THIS WAR, MR.

07:20

SECRETARY.

07:22

HOW IS IT POSSIBLE THAT THE

07:26

STATE DEPARTMENT WITH ALL OF ITS

07:28

RESOURCES WAS NOT ABLE TO REACH

07:31

A DEFINITIVE CONCLUSION ON

07:33

WHETHER ISRAEL HAS VIOLATED

07:34

INTERNATIONAL LAW?

07:36

>> PRECISELY BECAUSE WE CONTINUE

07:38

TO BE IN THE MID OFST OF THIS

07:40

REPORT AND MAKING IT REAL TIME

07:42

WHEN WE DON'T HAVE PEOPLE ON THE

07:43

GROUND, WHEN WE HAVE THAT MAKE

07:45

SURE THAT WE'RE GETTING

07:46

INFORMATION FROM ALL CONCERNED

07:48

THAT TAKES TIME AND WE WANT TO

07:50

MAKE SURE THAT WE WANT TO REACH

07:52

DEFINITIVE CONCLUSIONS, BUT AS

07:53

THE REPORT MAKES CLEAR, GIVEN

07:55

THE TOTALITY OF THE DAMAGE

07:56

THAT'S BEEN DONE TO CIVILIANS,

08:00

TO CHILDREN TO WOMEN TO MEN,

08:02

GIVEN THAT, GIVEN THE FACT THAT

08:04

ISRAEL CLEARLY HAS PROCEDURES,

08:06

RULES, REGULATIONS AND LAWS THAT

08:08

GO INTO THE TARGETING DECISIONS

08:10

THEY MAKE AND THE WAY THEY

08:12

CONDUCT THEMSELVESES AND THE

08:15

RESULTS THAT WE'VE SEEN IN TERMS

08:17

OF THE LOSS OF LIFE OF INNOCENT

08:20

CIVILIANS, IT'S REASONABLE TO

08:21

ASSESS AS WE SAY IN THE REPORT

08:22

THAT THERE ARE INSTANCES WHERE

08:24

THEY'VE ACTED INCONSISTENT WITH

08:26

OBLIGATIONS UNDER INTERNATIONAL

08:27

HUMANITARIAN LAW.

08:28

THOSE INVESTIGATIONS CONTINUE

08:30

BOTH BY US AND BY ISRAEL.

08:32

>> LET'S ZOOM OUT A BIT AND TALK

08:34

DID U.S. POLICY.

08:37

THE U.S. HAS URGED ISRAEL NOT TO

08:40

INVADE RAFAH AND TROOPS ARE ON

08:41

THE GROUND AND WE LEARNED THAT

08:44

300,000 PEOPLE ARE BEINGEC VAK

08:45

WAITED.

08:46

PRESIDENT BIDEN THREATENED TO

08:49

WITHHOLD CERTAIN WEAPONS WHILE

08:50

AT THE SAME TIME SENDING IN

08:52

OTHER WEAPONS AND BIG PICTURE.

08:54

WHY SHOULD ISRAEL BELIEVE THAT

08:55

THE U.S. IS WILLING TO BACK UP

09:01

ITS THREATS?

09:02

>> FIRST, LET'S STEP BACK FOR

09:04

ONE MINUTE AND NO ONE BEEN

09:06

WILLING TO DEFEND ISRAEL THAN

09:07

PRESIDENT BIDEN.

09:08

HE WAS THERE IN THE DAYS AFTER

09:10

OCTOBER 7th AND THE FIRST

09:12

PRESIDENT TO GO TO ISRAEL IN THE

09:14

MIDST OF A CONFLICT, WHEN IRAN

09:15

MOUNTED AN UNRESIDENTED ATTACK

09:17

ON ISRAEL.

09:18

300 PROJECTILES LAUNCHED AT

09:19

ISRAEL.

09:20

THE UNITED STATES FOR THE FOR

09:23

THE TIME EVER PARTICIPATED IN

09:25

THE ACT OF DEFENSE.

09:27

PRESIDENT BIDEN BROUGHT TOGETHER

09:28

A COALITION OF COUNTRIES TO

09:29

DEFEND ISRAEL AND NO ONE HAS

09:31

DONE MORE THAN JOE BIDEN.

09:32

AT THE SAME TIME WHAT WE'VE SEEN

09:34

OVER THE LAST FEW MONTHS IS A

09:35

DEEP CONCERN ON OUR PART ABOUT

09:37

THE POSSIBILITY OF A MAJOR

09:39

MILITARY OPERATION IN RAFAH

09:41

GIVEN THE DAMAGE IT WOULD DO TO

09:44

CIVILIANS AND THERE ARE MORE

09:47

THAN 1.4 MILLION GAZANS IN

09:49

RAFAH.

09:50

THAT'S AN INCREDIBLE PLAN TO GET

09:52

THEM OUT OF HARM'S WAY AND

09:54

SUPPORT THEM AND THE PRESIDENT

09:55

HAS BEEN CLEAR FOR SOME TIME

09:56

THAT WE COULDN'T AND WOULD NOT

09:58

SUPPORT A MAJOR MILITARY

10:00

OPERATION IN RAFAH.

10:01

AT THE SAME TIME WE SHARE

10:03

ISRAEL'S OBJECTIVE OF MAKING

10:05

SURE THAT HAMAS CANNOT GOVERN

10:07

GAZA ANYMORE AND ISRAEL GET ITS

10:09

LEADERS AND THERE'S A BETTER WAY

10:12

OF ACHIEVING THAT THAN GOING

10:14

HEADLONG INTO RAFAH.

10:15

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT

10:17

WITH ISRAEL NOW AND WE HAVE A

10:18

BETTER WAY OF DOING IT AND WE

10:20

ARE ENGAGED IN CONVERSATIONS

10:21

ABOUT THAT, BUT THE PRESIDENT

10:23

ANSWERING A QUESTION WAS VERY

10:24

CLEAR ABOUT WHERE WE ARE ON

10:25

RAFAH ITSELF AND WHAT WE WOULD

10:27

DO OR NOT DO IN THE EVENT THAT

10:31

THEY GO WITH THE MAJOR MILITARY

10:32

OPERATION.

10:33

>> I HEAR YOU SAYING A CREDIBLE

10:36

PLAN YET FOR HOW ISRAEL WOULD GO

10:42

INTO RAFAH AND MITIGATE CIVILIAN

10:43

CASUALTIES.

10:44

IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT PRESIDENT

10:46

BIDEN AND PRIME MINISTER

10:47

NETANYAHU ARE NOT SEEING EYE TO

10:48

EYE RIGHT NOW?

10:49

>> TWO THINGS.

10:51

ONE IS THAT AS THE PRESIDENT

10:52

SAID IN MANY CONVERSATIONS OVER

10:54

THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS, THERE

10:55

HAS TO BE A CREDIBLE PLAN FOR

10:56

THE CIVILIANS.

10:58

>> HAVE YOU SEEN A CREDIBLE

11:00

PLAN?

11:00

>> WE HAVE NOT.

11:02

SECOND, THERE'S SOMETHING ELSE

11:03

THAT'S IMPORTANT.

11:04

WE ALSO HAVEN'T SEEN A PLAN FOR

11:05

WHAT HAPPENS THE DAY AFTER THIS

11:07

WAR IN GAZA ENDS BECAUSE RIGHT

11:11

NOW THE TRAJECTORY THAT ISRAEL

11:12

IS ON IS EVEN IF IT GOES IN AND

11:15

TAKES HEAVY ACTION IN RAFAH

11:17

THERE WILL STILL BE THOUSANDS OF

11:19

ARMED HAMAS LEFT.

11:20

WE'VE SEEN IN AREAS THAT ISRAEL

11:24

HAS CLEARED IN THE NORTH EVEN IN

11:28

KHAN YOUNIS AND HAMAS COMING

11:29

BACK.

11:31

GOING INTO RAFAH EVEN TO DEAL

11:34

WITH THESE REMAINING BATTALIONS

11:35

ESPECIALLY IN THE ABSENCE OF A

11:37

PLAN FOR CIVILIANS RISKS DOING

11:40

TERRIBLE HARM TO CIVILIANS AND A

11:44

PROBLEM THAT WE WANT TO SOLVE

11:47

WHICH IS MACKING SUREKING SURE T

11:49

DOESN'T GOVERN GAZA AND ISRAEL

11:52

IS TO INHERIT AN INSURGENCE WITH

11:54

HAMAS LEFT OR IF IT LEAVES A

11:57

VACUUM FILLED BY CHAOS AND

11:59

ANARCHY AND REFILLED BY HAMAS,

12:01

WE'VE BEEN TALKING TO THEM ABOUT

12:03

A MUCH BETTER WAY TO GET AN

12:05

ENDURING RESULT BOTH IN GAZA

12:06

ITSELF AND MUCH MORE BROADLY IN

12:08

THE REGION.

12:11

THOSE CONVERSATIONS DONE AND

12:13

THAT'S WHAT PARTNERS AND ALLIES

12:15

DO.

12:15

WE ARE CLEAR-EYED AND WE SPEAK

12:17

THE TRUTH TO EACH OTHER AS WE

12:19

SEE IT.

12:20

WE HAVE AMERICAN INTERESTS FIRST

12:21

AND FOREMOST IN MIND.

12:22

WE ALSO HAVE ISRAEL'S INTEREST

12:24

IN MIND AND THERE MAY BE A

12:25

DIFFERENCE IN VIEW IN THE BEST

12:27

WAY TO ACHIEVE THEM, BUT THAT'S

12:28

ALSO THE NATURE OF THE

12:29

RELATIONSHIP.

12:29

>> I WANT TO DRILL DOWN WITH YOU

12:32

ON PRESIDENT BIDEN'S THREAT TO

12:34

WITHHOLD WEAPONS.

12:35

WHAT, EXACTLY, IS HIS RED LINE,

12:37

MR. SECRETARY?

12:38

WHAT WOULD TRIGGER HIM TO SAY I

12:40

AM NOW WITHHOLDING WEAPONS?

12:42

>> WE DON'T TALK ABOUT RED LINES

12:45

WHEN IT COMES TO ISRAEL.

12:47

>> PRESIDENT BIDEN DID TALK

12:49

ABOUT A RED LINE, THOUGH, MR.

12:52

SECRETARY, RESPECTFULLY?

12:53

WHAT WOULD TRIGGER HIM TO MAKE

12:54

THAT DECISION?

12:56

>> SURE.

12:59

FIRST, WE HAVE BEEN HOLDING BACK

13:01

AND WE'RE IN ACTIVE KFRLG

13:03

CONVERSATIONS WITH ISRAEL ABOUT

13:05

THE HEAVY AND HIGH PAYLOAD

13:07

WEAPONS, LARGE BOMBS BECAUSE OF

13:08

THE CONCERN THAT WE HAVE ABOUT

13:10

THE EFFECT THESE WEAPONS CAN

13:12

HAVE WHEN USED IN A DENSE, URBAN

13:13

ENVIRONMENT LIKE RAFAH.

13:14

WE ARE DISCUSSING THAT WITH

13:15

ISRAEL RIGHT NOW.

13:17

SECOND, WHAT THE PRESIDENT SAID

13:20

THAT IF ISRAEL GOES IN WITH A

13:23

MAJOR MILITARY OPERATION IN

13:24

RAFAH, IN THAT CASE THERE ARE

13:25

CERTAIN SYSTEMS THAT WE WILL NOT

13:27

PROVIDE TO ISRAEL THAT WOULD AID

13:29

THAT EFFORT BECAUSE IT'S

13:31

SOMETHING THAT WE DO NOT WANT TO

13:33

BE PART OF GIVEN THE DAMAGE THAT IT WOULD DO TO CIVILIANS AND

13:36

IT WOULD DO TO CIVILIANS AND

13:38

AGAIN, NOT TO ACHIEVE A DURABLE,

13:42

LASTING EFFECTIVE RESULT FOR

13:43

SECURITY AND THAT'S WHAT THE

13:44

PRESIDENT SAID AND WE SAID THAT

13:46

IN CONVERSATIONS WITH OUR

13:47

ISRAELI PARTNERS.

13:49

IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT LEAKED

13:52

OUT, BUT PRESIDENT RESPONDED

13:54

FORTHRIGHTLY ABOUT THE QUESTION.

13:56

>> MR. SECRETARY, I WANT TO ASK

13:58

YOU ABOUT THE VERY LATEST ABOUT

13:59

GETTING OF THE HOSTAGES RELEASED

14:01

FOR A CEASEFIRE.

14:02

WE KNOW THAT THE CIA DIRECTOR

14:05

HAS SINCE RETURNED HOME.

14:07

DID THOSE TALKS FALL APART

14:09

BECAUSE PRIME MINISTER NETANYAHU

14:11

WAS THREATENING AND IS MAKING

14:14

MOVES TO GO INTO RAFAH?

14:18

>> LOOK, FIRST IT'S IMPORTANT TO

14:21

REMIND OURSELVES THAT HAMAS

14:23

SHOULD HAVE ENDED THIS DAY ONE.

14:25

THIS NEVER SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED,

14:27

WAS THERE A CEASEFIRE THAT HAMAS

14:29

DESTROYED IN THE MOST BARBARIC

14:32

WAY POSSIBLE, HUMANLY

14:33

IMAGINABLE, BUT EVERY DAY AFTER

14:35

THAT, HAMAS COULD HAVE DECIDED

14:37

TO GIVE UP THE HOSTAGES AND STOP

14:39

HIDING BEHIND CIVILIANS, AND PUT

14:40

DOWN ITS WEAPONS AND ALL OF THIS

14:42

COULD HAVE BEEN OVER.

14:44

THE QUICKEST WAY FOR THIS TO END

14:46

IS FOR HAMS TO GIVE UP THE

14:48

HOSTAGES AND WE WOULD GET A

14:49

CEASEFIRE THAT WE CAN BUILD ON

14:51

AND BUILD SOMETHING MORE LASTING

14:53

AND MORE DURABLE.

14:56

THE DIFFERENT TEAMS CONTINUE TO

14:58

TALK.

14:59

IT REMAINS ABLEABLE THAT THE

15:01

FASTEST WAY TO GET TO A

15:03

CEASEFIRE AND THE FASTEST WAY TO

15:06

GET TO AN AGREEMENT IS THROUGH A

15:07

CEASEFIRE AND TO TRY TO GET IT

15:09

TO HAPPEN.

15:10

I THINK YOU CAN QUESTION WHETHER

15:12

HAMAS ACTUALLY WANTS TO GET

15:12

THIS.

15:13

IT WOULD ALSO BE THE BEST WAY

15:15

THAT WE CAN SURGE HUMANITARIAN

15:17

ASSISTANCE AND BETTER PROTECT

15:19

CIVILIANS IN GAZA.

15:21

HAMAS REPORTS TO BE INTERESTED

15:22

IN THAT.

15:23

ITS ACTIONS CERTAINLY

15:24

DEMONSTRATE THE OPPOSITE.

15:25

>> ALL RIGHT.

15:26

SECRETARY BLINKEN, THANK YOU SO

15:28

MUCH FOR YOUR TIME THIS MORNING.

15:30

WE REALLY APPRECIATE IT.

15:31

>> WHEN WE COME BACK,

15:33

INDEPENDENT SENATOR BERNIE

15:35

SANDERS OF VERMONT JOINS ME NEXT.

15:46

>>> WELCOME BACK.

15:48

>>> WELCOME BACK.

15:49

AS TENSIONS ON COLLEGE CAMPUSES

15:50

MOUNT, STUDENTS PROTESTED THE

15:52

WAR IN GAZA AT COMMENCEMENT

15:54

CEREMONIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

15:55

ON SATURDAY FROM BERKELEY,

15:57

CALIFORNIA, TO CHAPEL HILL,

15:59

NORTH CAROLINA AND MADISON,

16:00

WISCONSIN, DOZENS OF STUDENTS

16:02

WALKED OUT OF THE VIRGINIA

16:06

COMMONWEALTH UNIVERSITY CEREMONY

16:07

AS GOVERNOR GLEN YOUNGKIN

16:09

DELIVERED THE COMMENCEMENT

16:10

ADDRESS THERE.

16:12

JOINING ME IS THE INDEPENDENT

16:15

SENATOR FROM VERMONT, BERNIE

16:16

SANDERS.

16:17

SENATOR SANDERS, WELCOME BACK TO

16:19

"MEET THE PRESS".

16:20

>> GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.

16:23

>> WE APPRECIATE YOU BEING HERE

16:24

ON A BUSY SUNDAY MORNING AND I

16:27

WANT TO GET YOUR REACTION TO THE

16:29

STATE DEPARTMENT REPORT AND WHAT

16:31

YOU HEARD FROM THE SECRETARY OF

16:33

STATE DEFENDING THE REPORT AND

16:35

THERE WAS NO DEFINITIVE

16:37

CONCLUSION AND HE HAD NOT SEEN A

16:38

DEFINITIVE PLAN FROM ISRAEL TO

16:41

GO INTO RAFAH WITHOUT MITIGATING

16:42

CIVILIAN CASUALTIES.

16:43

WHAT WAS YOUR TAKEAWAY, SENATOR?

16:45

>> KRISTEN, I HAVE A LOT OF

16:48

RESPECT FOR TONY BLINKEN. HE HAS AN IMPOSSIBLY DIFFICULT

16:51

HE HAS AN IMPOSSIBLY DIFFICULT

16:54

JOB, BUT THE REALITY IS IS I

17:02

THINK AS ANY OBJECTIVE OBSERVER

17:05

KNOWS, ISRAEL HAS BROKEN

17:06

INTERNATIONAL LAW, IT HAS BROKEN

17:07

AMERICAN LAW AND ISRAEL SHOULD

17:11

NOT BE RECEIVING ANOTHER NICK

17:13

KNELLEL

17:14

IN U.S. MILITARY AID.

17:19

HAMAS IS A DISGUSTING TERRORIST

17:22

OESHGDZ

17:23

ORGANIZATION THAT BEGAN THIS WAR

17:25

AND WHAT ISRAEL HAS DONE IS IT

17:27

HAS GONE TO WAR AGAINST THE

17:29

ENTIRE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE AND

17:32

THE RESULTS HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY

17:34

CATASTROPHIC.

17:35

KRISTEN, WE'RE TALKING NOT JUST

17:40

35,000 PALESTINIANS DEAD AND

17:43

77,000 WOUNDED, TWO-THIRDS OF

17:44

WHOM ARE WOMEN AND CHILDREN AND

17:46

THAT IS NOT THE WAY YOU CONDUCT

17:48

CIVILIZED SOCIETY.

17:49

WE ARE TALKING ABOUT 60% OF THE

17:52

HOUSING IN GAZA HAVING BEEN

17:55

DESTROYED, THE CIVILIAN

17:56

INFRASTRUCTURE, THAT'S WATER,

17:57

THAT IS RAW SEWAGE.

18:01

RUNNING OUT INTO THE STREETS.

18:03

SNOW

18:03

NO ELECTRICITY.

18:04

YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT A

18:06

SYSTEMATIC DESTRUCTION OF THE

18:07

HEALTHCARE SYSTEM THERE, EVERY

18:08

UNIVERSITY IN GAZA HAS BEEN

18:11

BOMBED AND RIGHT NOW MOST

18:16

FRIGHTENINGLY, ACCORDING TO THE

18:18

HUMANITARIAN ORGANIZATIONS WE

18:20

ARE LOOKING AT THE LIKELIHOOD OF

18:23

HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF

18:27

CHILDREN FACING STARVATION, THE

18:30

FOREIGN ASSISTANCE ACT IS VERY

18:33

CLEAR, ANY ENTITY, ANY STATE,

18:36

ANY COUNTRY THAT BLOCKS U.S.

18:38

HUMANITARIAN AID IS IN VILEATION

18:42

OF LAW AND SHOULD NOT CONTINUE

18:45

TO RECEIVE MILL TAERITARY AID AN

18:47

IS PRECISELY WHAT ISRAEL HAS

18:47

DONE.

18:48

>> LET ME PRESS YOU.

18:50

YOU BELIEVE ISRAEL SHOULDN'T

18:52

RECEIVE ANOTHER CENT AND YET 26

18:53

HOUSE DEMOCRATS WROTE A LETTER

18:55

TO THE WHITE HOUSE SAYING,

18:57

QUOTE, THEY ARE DEEPLY CONCERNED

18:58

ABOUT THE MESSAGE THE

19:00

ADMINISTRATION IS SENDING TO

19:02

HAMAS AND OTHER IRANIAN-BACKED

19:03

TERRORIST PROXIES.

19:05

DOES WITHHOLDING WEAPONS TO

19:07

ISRAEL RUN THE RISK OF

19:10

PROLONGING THIS WAR AND WEAKENING ISRAEL'S HAND AGAINST

19:12

WEAKENING ISRAEL'S HAND AGAINST

19:15

HAMAS?

19:17

>> NO -- LOOK, EVERY REPUBLICAN,

19:21

AS I UNDERSTAND IT WANTS TO GIVE

19:24

HUGE AMOUNTS OF MONEY TO ISRAEL.

19:26

MY GUESS IS THAT MANY

19:28

REPUBLICANS WANT ISRAEL TO GO

19:30

INTO RAFAH DESPITE THE

19:32

INCREDIBLE HUMANITARIAN

19:33

DESTRUCTION THAT WILL CAUSE AND

19:35

THERE ARE DEMOCRATS WHO ALSO

19:36

FEEL THAT WAY, BUT THIS IS WHAT

19:41

I WILL TELL YOU, KRISTEN, THAT

19:44

IS NOT WHAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE

19:45

FEEL.

19:46

POLL AFTER POLL SUGGEST THAT THE

19:48

AMERICAN PEOPLE WANT AN

19:50

IMMEDIATE CEASEFIRE.

19:51

THEY WANT MASSIVE HUMANITARIAN

19:52

AID TO GET IN.

19:54

PEOPLE OF OUR COUNTRY DO NOT

19:55

WANT TO BE COMPLICIT IN THE STAR

19:58

VAGSZ OF HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS

19:59

OF CHILDREN.

20:01

BY THE WAY, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT

20:03

THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY, WE

20:05

ARE INCREASINGLY ISOLATED IN

20:08

TERMS OF OUR SUPPORT FOR ISRAEL

20:11

WHO IS BECOMING A PARIAH NATION.

20:14

>> SENATOR, IS THERE A

20:15

NON-MILITARY WAY TO GET RID OF

20:17

HAMAS GIVEN THE THREAT THAT THEY

20:18

POSE?

20:19

GIVEN THAN THEY SAY THEIR VERY

20:22

GOAL IS TO DESTROY ISRAEL'S

20:24

EXISTENCE?

20:25

>> YOU'RE RIGHT.

20:26

YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

20:28

LOOK, HAMAS -- THAT IS EXACTLY

20:29

RIGHT.

20:29

THAT IS THEIR GOAL.

20:31

IT IS DIFFICULT.

20:32

I DON'T WANT TO MINIMIZE THIS,

20:35

SO THE GOAL IS TO DEFEAT HAMAS,

20:38

BUT NOT TO DESTROY OR CAUSE THE

20:40

ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF DESTRUCTION

20:41

THAT WE ARE NOW SEEING IN GAZA,

20:44

AND I HOPE THAT THE FUTURE FOR

20:46

THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE IS A NEW

20:48

GENERATION OF PALESTINIAN

20:50

LEADERS WHO FOCUS ON ALLOWING

20:53

THE PEOPLE TO HAVE A STATE OF

20:55

THEIR OWN, LIKE TO SUPPORT A

20:57

TWO-STATE SOLUTION IMPROVING THE

20:58

ECONOMY AND REBUILDING THE

21:00

ECONOMY AND THAT'S A LONG-TERM

21:01

GOAL.

21:02

>> SENATOR, I HAVE TO ASK YOU

21:05

ABOUT SOME COMMENTS YOU MADE

21:06

THIS WEEK SAYING THAT THE MIDDLE

21:09

EAST, THE ISRAEL-HAMAS WAR COULD

21:13

BE BIDEN'S VIETNAM, ARGUING

21:15

POLITICALLY SPEAKING THIS COULD

21:16

COST HIM THE ELECTION.

21:18

IN THE WAKE OF BIDEN'S NEW

21:20

WARNING TO ISRAEL, DO YOU STAND

21:22

BY THOSE COMMENTS OR DO YOU

21:24

THINK THAT THE LANDSCAPE HAS NOW

21:27

CHANGED?

21:28

>> WELL, I CERTAINLY SUPPORT THE

21:31

PRESIDENT SAYING THAT IT IS

21:35

ABSURD TO PROVIDE ISRAEL WITH

21:37

2,000-POUND BOMBS WHICH COULD

21:38

LEVEL AN ENTIRE SQUARE BLOCK IN

21:42

THE MIDST OF RAFAH WHICH IS AN

21:45

INCREDIBLY DENSELY POPULATED

21:46

AREA SO THE PRESIDENT IS CLEARLY

21:46

RIGHT.

21:48

WHAT I WORRY ABOUT IS THAT THIS

21:52

WAR IN GAZA RIGHT NOW IS NOT

21:55

ONLY STRONGLY OPPOSED BY YOUNG

21:56

PEOPLE, BUT A WHOLE LOT OF

21:59

PEOPLE IN THE DEMOCRATIC BASE.

22:00

>> SO YOU THINK THIS COULD BE

22:01

HIS VIETNAM?

22:02

>> DO YOU STILL THINK THIS COULD

22:04

BE HIS VIETNAM?

22:06

>> LOOK, I AM STRONGLY

22:08

SUPPORTING THE PRESIDENT BECAUSE

22:09

ON MANY DOMESTIC ISSUES HE'S

22:11

DONE AN EXCELLENT JOB, BUT I

22:13

THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE

22:16

IN THE DEMOCRATIC BASE WHO ARE

22:18

CONCERNED ABOUT HIS SUPPORT FOR

22:19

ISRAEL IN THIS WAR.

22:21

>> SENATOR, VERY QUICKLY, YOU

22:24

HAVE TALKED ABOUT AND ANNOUNCED

22:27

THIS WEEK THAT YOU ARE RUNNING

22:31

FOR RE-ELECTION, OF COURSE.

22:33

THIS COMES -- YOU'RE 82 YEARS

22:34

OLD, AND I DON'T HAVE TO TELL

22:37

YOU THIS, BUT AGE IS OBVIOUSLY A

22:40

BIG ISSUE IN THE PRESIDENTIAL

22:40

ELECTION.

22:41

ARE YOU CONCERNED THAT AGE COULD

22:45

BE A POLITICAL LIABILITY FOR

22:46

YOU?

22:47

>> WELL, LOOK, I THINK AGE IS A

22:50

FACTOR, EXPERIENCE IS A FACTOR,

22:52

ACCOMPLISHMENT IS A FACTOR AND

22:54

MOST IMPORTANTLY A FACTOR IN

22:56

POLITICS IS WHAT DO YOU BELIEVE

22:57

IN?

22:58

AND I WOULD HOPE THAT THE PEOPLE

22:59

IN VERMONT AND THE PEOPLE OF THE

23:01

UNITED STATES LOOK AT CANDIDATES

23:03

IN THEIR TOTALITY.

23:05

I SHOULD ALSO TELL YOU, I WOULD

23:08

NOT HAVE RUN -- ANNOUNCED

23:10

RE-ELECTION, MY INTENTION TO

23:12

SEEK RE-ELECTION UNLESS I FELT

23:15

PRETTY GOOD, WITH THE EXCEPTION

23:16

OF A WEEK OFF OF COVID I HAVEN'T

23:19

MISSED A DAY OFF OF WORK.

23:20

I FEEL PRETTY GOOD.

23:22

>> THAT IS WHAT YOUR STAFF SAYS.

23:24

YOU NEVER TAKE VACATION.

23:25

LET ME ASK YOU, YES OR NO, DO

23:28

YOU THINK ISRAEL-HAMAS WAR

23:30

POTENTIALLY RUNS THE RISK OF

23:32

BEING BIDEN'S VIETNAM?

23:33

YES OR NO?

23:34

>> I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE

23:36

DISAPPOINTED -- WELL, IT'S

23:37

HURTING HIM POLITICALLY.

23:38

YES, OF COURSE, IT IS.

23:39

>> OKAY.

23:41

THERE YOU HAVE IT.

23:43

SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS, THANK

23:44

YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING ME

23:45

THIS MORNING.

23:46

I REALLY APPRECIATE THE

23:47

CONVERSATION.

23:48

>>> AND WHEN WE COME BACK,

23:50

REPUBLICAN SENATOR LINDSAY

23:50

GRAHAM OF SOUTH CAROLINA JOINS

23:51

ME NEXT.

23:51

♪ ♪

24:04

>>> WELCOME BACK.

24:04

>>> WELCOME BACK.

24:06

SENATE REPUBLICANS ARE

24:08

CRITICIZING PRESIDENT BIDEN FOR

24:11

PROVIDING THE HIGH PAYLOAD BOMBS

24:12

TO ISRAEL.

24:14

SOUTH CAROLINA SENATOR LINDSAY

24:16

GRAHAM GRILLED PENTAGON LEADERS.

24:18

>> IF WE STOP WEAPONS NECESSARY

24:21

TO DESTROY THE ENEMIES OF THE

24:23

STATE OF ISRAEL AT A TIME OF

24:25

GREAT PERIL, WE WILL PAY A

24:26

PRICE.

24:27

THIS IS OBSCENE.

24:29

IT IS ABSURD.

24:30

GIVE ISRAEL WHAT THEY NEED TO

24:32

FIGHT THE WAR THEY CAN'T AFFORD

24:33

TO LOSE.

24:35

THIS IS HIROSHIMA AND NAGASAKI

24:37

ON STEROIDS.

24:39

>> AND SENATOR LINDSAY GRAHAM

24:40

JOINS ME NOW.

24:42

SENATOR GRAHAM, WELCOME BACK TO

24:44

"MEET THE PRESS."

24:45

>> HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY.

24:47

>> THANK YOU, SENATOR.

24:48

I APPRECIATE THAT VERY MUCH.

24:50

LOOK, YOU HAVE BEEN QUITE CLEAR,

24:52

AS WE JUST HEARD THERE THAT YOU

24:57

ARE OPPOSED TO PRSZESIDENT BIDEN

25:00

THREAT TO WITHHOLD MILITARY AID

25:02

IF ISRAEL DOES INVADE RAFAH, BUT

25:04

LET ME ASK YOU THIS QUESTION WHY

25:06

SHOULDN'T ISRAEL'S WAR AGAINST

25:08

HAMAS PROCEED IN A MORE PRECISE

25:10

WAY WITH A CLEAR PLAN TO

25:13

MITIGATED CIVILIAN DEATHS IN

25:13

GAZA?

25:14

>> WELL, I THINK IT'S IMPOSSIBLE

25:17

TO MITIGATE CIVILIAN DEATHS IN

25:19

GAZA AS LONG AS HAMAS USES THEIR

25:23

OWN POPULATION AS HUMAN SHIELDS.

25:25

I'VE NEVER SEEN IN THE HISTORY

25:28

WARFARE SUCH BLATANT EFFORTS BY

25:30

AN ENEMY, HAMAS TO PUT CIVILIANS

25:32

AT RISK AND THE LAST THING YOU

25:34

WANT TO DO IS REWARD THIS

25:35

BEHAVIOR.

25:37

THEY PUT WEAPONS IN MOSQUES.

25:40

THEY FIRE ARTILLERY ROUNDS FROM

25:43

APARTMENT BUILDINGS.

25:45

THEY PUT COMMAND CENTERS UNDER

25:48

HOSPITALS TO MAXIMIZE CIVILIAN

25:50

CASUALTIES AS ISRAEL TRIES TO

25:52

DESTROY THE TERRORIST GROUP.

25:54

YOU DON'T WANT TO REWARD THIS BY

25:56

RESTRICTING WEAPONS TO THE

25:57

VICTIM OF THE ATTACK, BUT LET ME

25:58

JUST SAY THIS.

26:00

THIS IS MOTHER'S DAY, HAPPY

26:01

MOTHER'S DAY, BUT THIS IS A

26:03

TOUGH TIME FOR THE WORLD.

26:05

WHAT SENATOR SANDERS SAID, NOT

26:09

ANOTHER NICKEL OF MILITARY AID

26:11

TO THE UNITED STATES IS THE MOST

26:13

DANGEROUS, IRRESPONSIBLE

26:14

STATEMENT IN THE HISTORY OF THE

26:17

U.S. RELATIONSHIP.

26:18

THIS IS NOT VIETNAM.

26:20

ISRAEL IS IN A FIGHT FOR THEIR

26:21

LIVES.

26:22

HAMAS SAYS THEY WILL DO IT AGAIN

26:26

AND AGAIN AND AGAIN, THEY'RE

26:27

DEDICATED TO THE DESTRUCTION OF

26:29

THE JEWISH STATE AND NOT HELPING

26:31

PALESTINIAN PEOPLE.

26:32

IRAN, THE GREAT SATAN VIEWS TO

26:35

DESTROY ISRAEL AND HEZBOLLAH.

26:37

ISRAEL IS SURROUNDED BY

26:38

TERRORISTS THAT WANT TO DESTROY

26:40

THE JEWISH STATE AND NOT HELP

26:44

THE PALESTINIANS.

26:45

THIS IS NERVE AND

26:46

THIS IS 9/11 AND PEARL HARBOR

26:49

ALL ROLLED INTO ONE.

26:50

IT WOULD BE OUTRAGEOUS, DANGER

26:52

ROUSE AND THE REPUBLICANS WILL

26:53

FIGHT BACK AGAINST BERNIE

26:54

SANDERS AND THE SQUAD.

26:56

>> SENATOR, LET ME PUSH YOU A

26:58

LITTLE BIT, THOUGH, BECAUSE OF

27:00

COURSE, THE ISRAEL HAS PROVIDED

27:02

ISRAEL WITH TENS OF THOUSANDS OF

27:05

BOMBS AND MISSILES JUST APPROVED

27:06

SOME $14 BILLION IN MILITARY AID

27:08

LAST MONTH.

27:09

SO THE UNITED STATES, EVEN THE

27:12

IDF HAS SAID HAS GIVEN AN

27:13

EXTRAORDINARY AMOUNT OF SUPPORT.

27:15

I WANT TO ASK YOU, THOUGH, DO

27:17

YOU THINK ISRAEL IS IN ANY WAY

27:20

PREPARED TO LISTEN TO, TO WORK

27:22

WITH PRESIDENT BIDEN AND IS HE

27:25

TRUSTWORTHY AND LET ME ASK IT

27:29

THIS WAY, IN A SURVEY THIS WEEK

27:31

HELP HALF OF ISRAELIS THOUGHT

27:33

THE CHIEF CONSIDERATION THE

27:34

POLITICAL SURVIVAL.

27:35

YOU TRUST ISRAEL MORE THAN THE

27:37

U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY.

27:38

WHY SHOULD AMERICANS TRUST NETANYAHU TO PUT THE UNITED

27:40

NETANYAHU TO PUT THE UNITED

27:43

STATES INTERESTS FIRST?

27:46

>> AMERICANS SHOULD BE ALL IN IN

27:50

HELPING ISRAEL AGAINST AN

27:51

EXISTENTIAL THREAT.

27:52

THE ONE THING ISRAEL AND THE

27:55

U.S. HAVE IN COMMON, HAMAS WOULD

27:56

ATTACK US IF THEY COULD, IRAN IS

27:59

THE LARGEST STATE SPONSOR

28:00

TERRORISM THAT SHOUTS DEATH TO

28:02

AMERICA AND HOSE BELL ONNA IS IN

28:04

THE SAME CAMP.

28:05

I'VE NEVER HEARD ANYBODY IN

28:07

ISRAEL CHANT DEATH TO AMERICA.

28:08

THE PEOPLE ISRAEL IS FIGHTING

28:10

ARE BENT TO DESTROYING ALL OF

28:12

THE JEWS.

28:14

THIS IS HOLOCAUST REMEMBRANCE

28:16

MONTH FOR GOD'S SAKE.

28:18

WE SHOULD UNEQUIVOCALLY SUPPORT

28:20

ISRAEL AND YES, WORK WITH THEM

28:21

TO LIMIT CIVILIAN CASUALTIES.

28:23

THEY WANT TO DO THAT, I KNOW

28:24

THEY DO.

28:26

THEY HAVE A WHOLE BATTALION

28:29

DEDICATED TO THAT, BUT THIS IDEA

28:32

OF WITHHOLDING WEAPONS TO ISRAEL

28:36

IS PUTTING CIVILIANS AT RISK.

28:39

HERE'S MY STATEMENT TO THE

28:41

ADMINISTRATION, WORK OUT A PLAN

28:42

THAT GETS US ALL TO WHERE WE

28:44

NEED TO BE.

28:45

I SPOKE WITH ISRAEL THEY ARE

28:46

DISCUSSING WITH THE BIDEN

28:48

ADMINISTRATION A WAY FORWARD.

28:49

I AM SOMEWHAT HOPEFUL WE CAN

28:51

JUMP OVER THIS IMPASSE, BUT DO

28:54

NOT LET BERNIE SANDERS RUN THIS

28:54

WAR.

28:55

BURDENY SANDERS AND THE SQUAD

28:57

ARE INSANE WHEN IT COMES TO HOW

28:59

TO DEFEND ISRAEL.

29:00

HE JUST SAID ON NATIONAL

29:02

TELEVISION CUT OFF EVERY NICKEL

29:04

OF MILITARY AID TO THE JEWISH

29:07

STATE WHO IS BEING THREATENED

29:10

WITH OBLIVION, SHUT THESE PEOPLE

29:11

DOWN.

29:12

THIS DECISION WAS POLITICAL.

29:15

HE IS TRYING TO APPEASE THE

29:17

RIGHT AND LEFT.

29:18

>> THE POSITION NOT TO CUT OFF

29:20

EVERY NICKEL AND I GUESS THE

29:23

QUESTION IS WHY DOES ISRAEL NEED

29:26

THE MOST MASSIVE BOMBS THAT

29:28

COULD POTENTIALLY LEVEL AN

29:29

ENTIRE BLOCK IN ORDER TO WAGE

29:30

THIS WAR?

29:32

WHY CAN'T IT BE MORE PRECISE?

29:36

>> LISTEN, YOU KNOW, HERE'S WHAT

29:38

I WOULD SAY ABOUT FIGHTING AN

29:40

ENEMY WHO WANTS TO KILL YOU AND

29:42

YOUR FAMILY.

29:43

WHY DO WE DROP TWO BOMBS,

29:46

NUCLEAR BOMBS ON HIROSHIMA AND

29:48

NAGASAKI TO END A WAR THAT WE

29:50

COULD AREN'T AFFORD TO LOSE?

29:51

YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND APPARENTLY

29:53

WHAT ISRAEL IS FACING.

29:56

THEY'RE FACING THREE GROUPS,

29:58

IRAN WHO HAS RECEIVED $80

30:00

BILLION IN AID.

30:02

WHEN TRUMP LEFT OFFICE THEY WERE

30:04

EXPORTING 300 BILLION OILS OF

30:07

DAY AND NOW THEY ARE 1.3 MILLION

30:09

A DAY.

30:10

THEY'VE BEEN ENRICHED BY BIDEN

30:11

AND THEY'VE TAKEN THAT MONEY TO

30:13

KILL ALL OF THE JEWS.

30:14

WHEN WE WERE FACED WITH

30:17

DESTRUCTION AS A NATION AFTER

30:19

PEARL HARBOR FIGHTING THE

30:21

JAPANESE WE DECIDED TO END THE

30:23

WAR BY THE BOMBING HIROSHIMA AND

30:25

NAGASAKI WITH NUCLEAR WEAPONS

30:27

AND THAT WAS THE RIGHT DECISION.

30:28

GIVE ISRAEL THE BOMBS THEY NEED

30:30

TO END THE WAR THEY CAN'T AFFORD

30:31

TO LOSE AND WORK WITH THEM TO

30:33

MINIMIZE CASUALTIES.

30:35

>> SENATOR, MILITARY OFFICIALS

30:37

WOULD ARGUE THAT THERE HAS BEEN

30:40

SO MUCH TECHNOLOGY SINCE THOSE

30:42

BOMBS WERE DROPPED THAT FOR THAT

30:45

VERY REASON THAT IS WHY ISRAEL

30:47

AND OTHER DEVELOPED CAN BE MORE

30:49

PRECISE, BUT LET ME ASK IT THIS

30:50

WAY BECAUSE PRESIDENT BIDEN IS

30:52

NOT THE FIRST PRESIDENT TO USE

30:53

ARMED SHIPMENTS TO TRY TO

30:55

INFLUENCE ISRAELI POLICY.

30:56

AS YOU KNOW FORMER PRESIDENT

30:58

RONALD REAGAN ON MULTIPLE

31:00

OCCASIONS WITHHELD WEAPONS TO

31:02

IMPACT ISRAEL'S MILITARY

31:03

ACTIONS.

31:04

DID PRESIDENT REAGAN SHOW THAT

31:06

USING U.S. MILITARY AID AS

31:09

LEVERAGE CAN ACTUALLY BE AN

31:13

EFFECTIVE WAY TO REIN IN AND

31:17

IMPACT ISRAEL'S POLICY?

31:18

>> WHEN YOU'RE TELLING THE WORLD

31:21

YOU WILL RESTRICT WEAPONS

31:22

DELIVERY TO THE JEWISH STATE WHO

31:24

IS FIGHTING A WAR FOR THEIR

31:27

SURVIVAL IT EMBOWDENS IRAN, IT

31:30

EMBOLDENS HAMAS.

31:32

IT IS TOO STUCK ON THE IDEA FOR

31:35

THE UNITED STATES AND ISRAEL,

31:37

THIS IS THE WORST DECISION IN

31:41

THE HISTORY OF THE U.S.

31:43

RELATIONSHIP.

31:44

AT A TIME THE JEWISH STATE CAN

31:47

BE DESTROYED AND HERE'S WHAT I

31:48

WOULD SAY.

31:49

THERE IS SOME HOPE WE CAN GET

31:52

OVER THIS, NON-NEGOTIABLE WITH

31:54

THE DESTRUCTION OF HAMAS.

31:57

NOBODY IN ISRAEL WILL ALLOW

31:59

HAMAS TO BE STANDING.

32:01

HOW WE GET THERE IS SECOND TO

32:03

NEGOTIATION.

32:03

MY PROBLEM IS NOT WITH THE

32:06

WEAPONS ISRAEL IS USING AND MY

32:07

PROBLEM IS WITH THE HAMAS ISSUES

32:09

AND THE IDEA THAT AMERICA WOULD

32:12

NOT SEND A NICKEL OF AID ECHOED

32:13

BY THE UNITED STATES SENATOR

32:16

WHEN ALL OF THE JEWS ARE TRYING

32:19

TO BE KILLED BY RADICAL ISLAMIC

32:21

GROUPS TELLS US WHERE WE ARE AT

32:22

AS A NATION.

32:24

THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS WITH

32:26

ISRAEL WITHOUT APOLOGY.

32:27

>> HISTORIANS WOULD SAY WHY IS

32:29

IT OKAY FOR REAGAN TO DO IT AND

32:32

NOT PRESIDENT BIDEN, BUT LET ME

32:33

ASK YOU --

32:35

>> WHY IS IT OKAY FOR AMERICA TO

32:38

DROP TWO NUCLEAR BOMBS ON

32:41

HIROSHIMA AND NAGASAKI TO END

32:43

THEIR EXISTENTIAL WAR?

32:45

WHY WAS IT OKAY FOR US TO DO

32:47

THAT.

32:48

TO ISRAEL, DO WHATEVER YOU HAVE

32:50

TO DO TO SURVIVE AS A JEWISH

32:52

STATE.

32:52

WHATEVER YOU HAVE TO DO.

32:54

>> LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT HOW --

32:57

>> THESE MILITARY OFFICIALS THAT

32:58

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT --

33:00

>> LET ME ASK YOU.

33:01

>> ARE FULL OF CRAP.

33:02

>> LET ME ASK YOU SOMETHING THEY

33:04

KNOW YOU CARE A LOT ABOUT AND

33:06

THAT IS THE SAUDI NORMALIZATION

33:07

DEAL.

33:07

>> YES.

33:09

>> HOW WOULD A GROUND INVASION

33:11

INTO RAFAH IMPACT WHAT YOU

33:14

BELIEVE IS CRITICAL, GETTING A

33:16

DEAL FOR NORMALIZATION IN THE

33:18

REGION WITH SAUDI ARABIA.

33:19

>> REALLY GOOD QUESTION.

33:21

>> NUMBER ONE, I WANT TO KEEP

33:24

PURSUING THIS BECAUSE YOU ASKED

33:25

TONY A GOOD QUESTION.

33:26

WHAT HAPPENS THE DAY AFTER.

33:28

TO MY FRIENDS IN ISRAEL, WHAT

33:29

WAS THE DAY AFTER?

33:30

TO TONY, WHAT HAPPENS THE DAY

33:31

AFTER?

33:32

I WANT THE ARAB WORLD, THE UAE

33:34

AND SAUDI ARABIA TO COME IN AND

33:36

GIVE THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE HOPE

33:37

ONCE WE DESTROY HAMAS.

33:40

I WANT NORMALIZATION BETWEEN

33:42

SAWED RABEUDI ARABIA AND ISRAEL

33:44

THAT'S THE WORST NIGHTMARE FOR

33:45

IRAN AND THAT'S WHY OCTOBER 7th,

33:47

I THINK, HAPPENED.

33:48

HERE'S WHAT'S HAPPENED.

33:50

WHEN YOU DENY ISRAEL WEAPONS THE

33:53

SAUDIS ARE BEGINNING TO WONDER,

33:55

AM I A GOOD ALLY?

33:56

SHOULD I SIGN UP TO THIS?

33:58

WOULD THEY TURN ON ME IF I GET

34:00

IN A CONFLICT?

34:02

THE BIGGEST THREAT TO THE DEAL

34:04

IS TO USE RAFAH INVASION TO BACK

34:05

ISRAEL OFF.

34:07

I AM STILL GOING TO PURSUE THE

34:09

DEAL.

34:09

I HOPE WE CAN GET THIS ISSUE

34:11

WITH THE WEAPONS TRANSFERS

34:13

BEHIND US AND WE CAN GET BACK ON

34:15

SETTING THE CONDITIONS WHERE WE

34:16

CAN NORMALIZE BETWEEN SAUDI

34:18

ARABIA AND ISRAEL AND AS PART OF

34:21

THAT HAVE A NEW PALESTINIAN

34:23

OPPORTUNITY WHERE THEY'LL HAVE A

34:25

BETTER LIFE, WHERE THE ARABS

34:27

HELPED THEM BUILD GAZA AND THE

34:28

WEST BANK.

34:29

I'M NOT GIVING UP ON THAT.

34:31

I'VE JUST NEVER BEEN MORE

34:33

WORRIED ABOUT WHAT THE SIGNALS

34:35

WE'RE SENDING TO OUR ENEMIES

34:36

THAN I AM RIGHT NOW.

34:39

WHEN WE ARE DOING WITH ISRAEL IS

34:41

UNCONSCIONABLE AND IT NEEDS TO

34:41

STOP.

34:42

WE NEED TO BE WITH ISRAEL

34:45

WITHOUT APOLOGY.

34:46

>> VERY QUICKLY, BEFORE I LET

34:49

YOU GO.

34:50

A QUESTION ABOUT 2024, WILL YOU

34:53

ACCEPT THE RESULTS OF THE 2024

34:55

ELECTION NO MATTER WHO WINS?

34:57

>> YEAH, I'LL ACCEPT IT, BUT I

35:00

THINK THERE'S NO MASSIVE

35:01

CHEATING.

35:01

I ACCEPTED 2020.

35:03

HERE'S WHAT I WOULD SAY.

35:04

PRESIDENT TRUMP IS POISED TO

35:05

WIN.

35:05

HE SAID LAST NIGHT WHEN IT COMES

35:08

TO ISRAELI WILL HAVE THEIR BACK

35:09

AND I'LL GIVE THEM WHAT THEY

35:10

NEED.

35:11

BERNIE SAND SERS WRONG ABOUT THE

35:12

POLLING HERE.

35:14

MOST AMERICAN, 80% SIDE WITH

35:15

ISRAEL.

35:16

THE 20%, UNFORTUNATELY, ARE A

35:19

CONGRESS AND A STATE DEPARTMENT

35:21

THAT SIDE WITH HAMAS.

35:22

THAT'S THE PROBLEM WITH THIS

35:23

WAR.

35:24

>> ALL RIGHT, SENATOR, WE ARE

35:26

OUT OF TIME.

35:27

SENATOR GRAHAM, I SHOULD SAY,

35:31

YOU JUST INVOKED ANOTHER

35:33

SENATOR'S NAME.

35:34

>> WE ARE OFTEN CONFUSED.

35:36

>> HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY.

35:37

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

35:38

APPRECIATE YOU JOINING US.

35:41

WHEN WE COME BACK, OLYMPIC SWIMMER MICHAEL PHELPS

35:49

>>> WELCOME BACK.

35:50

>>> WELCOME BACK.

35:51

MAY IS MENTAL HEALTH AWARENESS

35:54

MONTH AND 23-TIME GOLD MEDALIST

35:56

MICHAEL PHELPS, THE MOST

35:58

DECORATED OLYMPIAN OF ALL TIME

36:00

IS OPENING UP ABOUT HIS BATTLE

36:02

WITH DEPRESSION.

36:04

PHELPS SAT DOWN WITH ME FOR A

36:06

MEET THE MOMENT CONVERSATION AND

36:09

TALKED ABOUT HOW HE DEALS WITH

36:13

HIS MENTAL HEALTH STRUGGLES AND

36:14

HIS ACTIVISM.

36:16

>> WHEN DID YOU FIRST REALIZE

36:18

YOU WERE REALLY STRUGGLING WITH

36:19

DEPRESSION?

36:20

>> I WOULD SAY PROBABLY 2004.

36:24

2004 WAS MY FIRST TASTE OF

36:27

POST-OLYMPIC DEPRESSION.

36:28

COMING OFF SUCH A HIGH IT'S

36:31

BASICALLY LIKE THE EDGE OF A

36:33

CLIFF, LIKE COOL, NOW WHAT?

36:35

I GUESS I HAVE TO WAIT FOUR MORE

36:37

YEARS FOR THE CHANCE TO DO IT

36:39

AGAIN AND FOR THOSE THAT DON'T

36:42

HAVE A SUCCESSFUL OLYMPICS THOSE

36:45

FOUR YEARS ARE ABSOLUTELY -- SO

36:48

FOR ME, 2004 WAS THE FIRST CASE

36:50

OF POST-OLYMPIC DEPRESSION

36:52

BECAUSE COMING OFF OF THAT HIGH

36:53

AFTER DOING SOMETHING YOU SET

36:55

OUT TO DO YOUR WHOLE ENTIRE

36:56

LIFE.

36:57

MY GOAL WAS TO DO SOMETHING NO

36:59

ONE ELSE HAD EVER DONE BEFORE,

37:01

AND I DID IT BY THE AGE OF 19,

37:02

20.

37:03

>> DID YOU KNOW IT WAS

37:05

DEPRESSION OR DID YOU JUST THINK

37:07

I'M FEELING A LITTLE OFF?

37:08

>> THINK AT THAT POINT, YOU

37:10

KNOW, I'LL SAY AS A MALE ATHLETE

37:13

I CAN TELL SOMETHING WAS OFF,

37:15

BUT I THINK I SAW IT AS A SIGN

37:17

OF WEAKNESS AND IF I SHARED

37:19

ANYTHING ABOUT IT IT WOULD GIVE

37:20

MY COMPETITORS AN EDGE, AND I'M

37:22

NOT TRYING TO DO THAT, RIGHT?

37:23

I DON'T WANT TO GIVE MY

37:24

COMPETITORS AN EDGE.

37:26

I'M TRYING TO BE BETTER THAN

37:27

ANYBODY, PERIOD, HAS EVER BEEN.

37:29

SO FOR ME, I LOOKED AT IT AS

37:31

WEAKNESS.

37:31

SO FOR ME, I HAD TO LEARN THAT

37:34

VULNERABILITY IS A GOOD THING,

37:36

AND IT WAS SCARY AT FIRST, BUT I

37:38

LEARNED THAT VULNERABILITY JUST

37:40

MEANS CHANGE AND FOR ME IT WAS A

37:43

GREAT CHANGE.

37:44

>> IF YOU OR SOMEONE YOU KNOW IS

37:46

STRUGGLING OR IN CRISIS, HELP IS

37:48

AVAILABLE.

37:49

CALL OR TEXT 988 OR CHAT AT

37:54

988LIFELINE.ORG.

37:54

YOU CAN HEAR MORE OF OUR

37:58

CONVERSATION WITH MICHAEL PHELPS

38:00

NEXT SUNDAY HERE ON "MEET THE

38:01

PRESS" AND TUNE INTO THE PARIS

38:02

OLYMPICS ON NBC AND PEACOCK.

38:04

WHEN WE COME BACK, DONALD

38:06

TRUMP'S FORMER ATTORNEY MICHAEL

38:07

COHEN IS EXPECTED TO TAKE THE

38:08

STAND THIS WEEK. THE PANEL IS NEXT

38:16

>>> WELCOME BACK.

38:16

>>> WELCOME BACK.

38:17

THE PANEL IS HERE.

38:18

NBC NEWS WHITE HOUSE

38:20

CORRESPONDENT MONICA ALBA, JEN

38:22

PSAKI, FORMER WHITE HOUSE PRESS

38:23

SECRETARY, HOST OF "INSIDE WITH

38:26

JEN PSAKI" AND AUTHOR OF THE NEW

38:29

BOOK "SAY MORE.

38:30

LESSONS FROM WORK, THE WHITE

38:32

HOUSE AND THE WORLD AND STEPHEN

38:35

HAYES, EDITOR OF "THE DISPATCH."

38:36

JEN, HERE WE HAVE YOUR BOOK WITH

38:37

US.

38:38

HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY.

38:38

>> THANK YOU.

38:39

>> HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY.

38:41

>> WE'LL HAVE A SIGNING AFTER

38:42

THE SHOW.

38:43

>> MONICA, START US OFF AND SET

38:45

THE TABLE HERE AND OBVIOUSLY

38:47

THIS EXTRAORDINARY WARN BY

38:48

PRESIDENT BIDEN THIS WEEK SAYING

38:49

THAT HE WOULD CUT OFF MILITARY

38:51

AID AND IT'S BEEN THE FOCUS OF

38:53

ALL OF THESE CONVERSATIONS THAT

38:54

WE'VE HAD THIS MORNING.

38:55

WHAT PROMPTED HIM TO MAKE THAT

38:57

WARNING THIS WEEK?

38:58

WAS IT THE BUILDUP OF POLITICAL

38:59

PRESSURE?

39:00

WAS IT HIS OWN FRUSTRATION WITH

39:02

ISRAEL?

39:03

WHITE HOUSE OFFICIALS WILL TELL

39:04

YOU THAT FOR DECADES THIS

39:06

PRESIDENT MAKES FOREIGN POLICY

39:08

DECISIONS BASED ON NATIONAL

39:09

SECURITY AND NOT ON POLITICS,

39:11

BUT IN ALL MY CONVERSATIONS WITH

39:13

BIDEN ADVISERS OVER THE COURSE

39:15

OF THIS CONSEQUENTIAL LAST WEEK,

39:16

THEY CAN SEE THAT IT IS

39:17

IMPOSSIBLE TO IGNORE THE

39:20

POLITICAL RAMIFICATIONS HERE AND

39:21

THEY CERTAINLY TALK ABOUT THAT

39:23

IN THE CONTEXT OF THIS POLICY

39:25

SHIFT, OF DRAWING THAT LINE AS

39:27

YOU WERE DISCUSSING AND IT IS

39:30

VERY NOTABLE.

39:30

THEY POINT OUT THAT ISRAEL HAS

39:32

THE WEAPONS IT NEEDS TO GO

39:34

FORWARD WITH THIS FULL-SCALE

39:35

INVASION INTO RAFAH.

39:36

SO THE PRESIDENT THREATENING TO

39:38

WITHHOLD THAT MILITARY AID IS

39:40

LARGELY SYMBOLIC IN MANY WAYS

39:43

AND IT IS ABOUT A POLITICAL

39:44

MESSAGING AND SIGNALING AT THIS

39:46

POINT IN THE WAR AND IT COMES

39:48

AMID THIS LARGER BACKDROP OF

39:50

DEMOCRATIC DIVISIONS WITHIN THE

39:51

PRESIDENT'S OWN PARTY AS YOU

39:52

JUST SAW THERE IN YOUR INTERVIEW

39:54

WITH SENATOR SANDERS THAT WERE

39:56

PROGRESSIVE AND WHO HAVE BEEN

39:57

VERY CRITICAL OF THE PRESIDENT

39:58

DURING THIS WAR WHO NOW ARE

39:59

PRAISING THIS MOVE AND THERE ARE

40:01

OTHERS WHO REALLY ARE NOT

40:02

CONVINCED AND WHO SAY THIS

40:04

DOESN'T MEAN MUCH AT THIS POINT

40:06

GIVEN THE MASS NUMBER OF

40:09

CIVILIAN CASUALTIES AND THE REAL

40:12

LACK OF HUMANITARIAN AID GETTING

40:13

INTO GAZA.

40:14

>> YEAH.

40:15

AND THAT DIVIDE, JEN, IT IS SO

40:18

STARK FOR THE CAMPAIGN, FOR

40:19

THOSE CLOSE TO PRESIDENT BIDEN.

40:20

YOU ACTUALLY THINK HE SHOULD

40:22

HAVE SPOKEN OUT AND DONE THIS

40:24

SOONER.

40:25

>> I THINK THAT AS IT RELATED TO

40:28

THE DIPLOMATIC ASPECT.

40:29

I WORKED WITH SECRETARY KERRY

40:30

FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS.

40:33

I WENT 30 TIMES TO ISRAEL AND I

40:35

SPENT A LOT OF TIME IN THOSE

40:36

NEGOTIATING ROOPS WITH PRIME

40:37

MINISTER NETANYAHU.

40:38

THE POLITICS OF THIS ARE VERY

40:39

HARD TO PREDICT.

40:40

THERE'S NO QUESTION AND THERE'S

40:43

A LOT OF ACTIVISM ON CAMPUS AND

40:44

ANTISEMITISM IN THE COUNTRY AND

40:46

A LOT OF DYNAMICS POLITICALLY.

40:49

THE BEST THING THEY CAN DO IS

40:52

REACH A CEASEFIRE AND THAT'S THE

40:53

BEST THING THEY CAN DO.

40:55

TO ADD WHAT MONICA SAID, WHAT

40:57

PRESIDENT BIDEN IS DOING, HE'S

40:59

BEEN HAVING TOUGHER PRIVATE

40:59

CONVERSATIONS.

41:00

SOME OF THOSE HAVE BEEN READ OUT

41:02

WITH PRIME MINISTER NETANYAHU.

41:03

THIS IS THE USE OF LEVERAGE AND

41:04

THAT'S HOW DIPLOMACY WORKS AND

41:06

IT'S THREATENING IF YOU DON'T

41:07

CHANGE YOUR BEHAVIOR THIS IS

41:09

WHAT WILL HAPPEN AND IT'S NOT

41:11

WALKING AWAY FROM ISRAEL'S

41:12

SECURITY AND IT IS USING

41:13

LEVERAGE SO THAT THEY DON'T GO

41:15

INTO A CITY THAT HAS A MILLION

41:16

PEOPLE AND THAT IS WHAT THEY'RE

41:17

TRYING TO DO RIGHT NOW.

41:19

>> THEY MAY NOT BE WALKING AWAY

41:21

FROM ISRAEL'S SECURITY AND IT IS

41:23

UNDERMINING ISRAEL'S SECURITY

41:24

AND PRESIDENT BIDEN SAID THIS

41:25

HIMSELF BACK IN OCTOBER THE DAY

41:27

AFTER THE ATTACK AND THE MORE

41:28

SEPARATION THAT THERE IS BETWEEN

41:29

THE UNITED STATES AND ISRAEL THE

41:31

GREATER STRENGTH IT GIVES TO

41:33

HAMAS AND HEZBOLLAH AND ISRAEL'S

41:35

ENEMY AND BOTH IN WORD AND DEED

41:37

WHAT WE SAW FROM THE BIDEN

41:39

ADMINISTRATION THIS WEEK WAS

41:40

THIS WEAKENING.

41:41

THIS WAS A SEVEN-MONTH PROCESS

41:42

AND HE CAME OUT STRONG IN THE

41:44

BEGINNING AND NOW GIVEN THE

41:46

REASONS THAT SENATOR SANDERS HAS

41:47

ARTICULATED AND GIVEN THE FACT

41:49

THAT THERE'S THIS BUILDUP OF

41:51

DOMESTIC, POLITICAL PRESSURE ON

41:53

JOE BIDEN YOU'RE SEEING HIM

41:54

CREATE THIS SPACE IN A WAY

41:56

THAT'S LIKELY TO INTENSIFY THE

41:58

CIVILIAN DAMAGE AND LENGTHEN THE

41:58

CONFLICT OVERALL.

42:00

>> I THINK THIS IS A VERY WRONG

42:02

READ.

42:03

>> HOW DO YOU REALLY FEEL?

42:05

>> THE POLITICS ARE IMPORTANT.

42:07

THEY'RE ALSO UNPREDICTABLE AND

42:09

YOU HAVE TO BE PRESENT AND WATCH

42:10

THAT CLOSELY.

42:11

THERE IS ALSO THE POTENTIAL FOR

42:12

THE ISRAELI MILITARY TO GO INTO

42:14

THE CITY OF A MILLION PEOPLE

42:16

WHERE 300,000 PEOPLE HAVE

42:19

ALREADY LEFT.

42:19

NO ONE HAS BEEN MORE SUPPORTIVE

42:21

OF THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT AND TO

42:23

THE FRUSTRATION OF MANY

42:24

DEMOCRATS THAN JOE BIDEN AND THE

42:26

ALTERNATIVE OF NOT USING

42:28

LEVERAGE IS THE ISRAELI MILITARY

42:30

GOING IN AND ABSOLUTELY LEVELING

42:32

RAFAH, KILLING HUNDREDS OF

42:33

THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE THAT WON'T

42:35

DESTROY HAMAS AND ANY

42:36

INTELLIGENCE OFFICIAL WILL TELL

42:38

YOU THAT AND THERE ARE NO PLANS

42:40

FOR THE DAY AFTER AND THAT'S NOT

42:44

ACTUALLY AN EFFECTIVE, WISE

42:45

STRATEGY.

42:46

>> THE UNITED STATES IS

42:48

WITHHOLDING KEY INTELLIGENCE ON

42:49

HAMAS LEADERSHIP IN RAFAH AND ON

42:51

THE TUNNELS.

42:52

HOW DOES WITHHOLDING THAT

42:53

INTELLIGENCE MAKE IT MORE LIKELY

42:55

THAT ISRAEL SUCCEEDS IN MEETING

42:57

ITS MILITARY OBJECTIVES.

42:58

>> AND THAT IS THE DEBATE AND

43:00

THE CRUX OF WHAT YOU ARE BOTH

43:02

SAYING WHICH IS WHAT YOU ARE

43:04

SAYING AND HOW DO YOU WAGE THIS

43:06

WAR AND MONICA, IT DOES COME

43:08

AGAINST THE BACKDROP OF THIS

43:09

CAMPAIGN THAT IS RAMPING UP AND

43:12

OF COURSE, THE QUESTION IS WHERE

43:14

DOES THIS GO ON THE TRAIL?

43:16

HOW DO WE SEE IT PLAY OUT ON THE

43:17

TRAIL?

43:18

YOU ACTUALLY HAVE SOME NEW

43:20

REPORTING NOT NECESSARILY AS IT

43:22

RELATES IN THE WAR IN THE MIDDLE

43:24

EAST AND AS IT RELATES WITH THE

43:26

BIDEN CAMPAIGN IS HOW TO

43:28

INTENSIFY AND GALVANIZE ITS

43:30

SUPPORTERS AGAINST SOME OF THE

43:32

ADMINISTRATIVE SUPPORT AND.

43:33

>> AND THAT IS THE REMINDER THAT

43:35

WE ARE MONTHS AWAY FROM THE

43:37

CRITICAL ELECTION AND THE BIDEN

43:39

CAMPAIGN IS TRYING TO WAGE THAT

43:41

FIGHT WHILE DEALING WITH THIS

43:42

VERY SERIOUS CHALLENGE OVERSEAS,

43:44

BUT IN TERMS OF THAT

43:46

FUND-RAISING.

43:47

FOR A LONG TIME, THE DNC HAS HAD

43:49

A CASH ADVANTAGE.

43:51

THAT'S ABOUT TO LOOK VERY

43:54

DIFFERENT FOR REPUBLICANS WITH

43:55

FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP AND THE

43:57

RNC THAT NOW HE HAS CLINCHED THE

44:00

NOMINATION AND YOU CAN SEE THE

44:02

BIDEN TEAM WITH TRYING TO BOOST

44:04

THE FUND-RAISING STAR POWER AND

44:05

THEY'LL DO A FUNDRAISER WITH

44:07

GEORGE CLOONEY, JULIA ROBERTS

44:09

AND FORMER PRESIDENT OBAMA IN

44:10

MID-JUNE IN LOS ANGELES AND

44:11

THERE WILL ALSO BE A FUNDRAISER

44:13

WITH FORMER PRESIDENT BILL

44:14

CLINTON AND FORMER SECRETARY OF

44:16

STATE HILLARY CLINT EARLIER THIS

44:17

SUMMER.

44:18

THEY SEE A DIRECT LINE FROM HUGE

44:20

HALLS FROM EVENTS LIKE THAT TO

44:23

BEING ABLE TO BUILD

44:25

INFRASTRUCTURE AND OPEN OFFICES

44:26

AND HIRE KEY STAFF IN THOSE

44:28

CRITICAL BATTLEGROUND STATES

44:30

WHERE YES, SOME OF THOSE YOUNG

44:34

VOTERS WHO ARE SO DIS, LUGSZILLU

44:36

WITH THE CRITICAL HANDLING OF

44:38

THE WAR AND THEY'LL GO ALL IN ON

44:39

THAT.

44:40

>> STEPHEN, THE BACKDROP TO THE

44:43

BIDEN CAMPAIGN KIND OF RELYING

44:45

ON THIS CELEBRITY POWER IS WE

44:46

ARE SEEING DONALD TRUMP IN COURT

44:47

DAY AFTER DAY.

44:49

THIS WEEK, MICHAEL COHEN TAKES

44:51

THE STAND THIS PAST WEEK, STORMY

44:53

DANIEL, THE ADULT FILM STAR AT

44:54

THE CENTER OF THE HUSH MONEY

44:56

TRIAL WAS ON THE STAND.

44:59

HE WAS IN NEW JERSEY OVERNIGHT

45:02

CAMPAIGNING, TAKING AIM AT THESE

45:04

LEGAL BATTLES AND HOW DO YOU SEE

45:07

THIS PLAYING OUT MOVING FORWARD?

45:09

DO YOU THINK THESE LEGAL BATTLES

45:11

WILL ALIENATE SOME OF THOSE

45:13

CRITICAL INDEPENDENT WOMEN,

45:14

MODERATE VOTERS THAT HE NEEDS TO

45:14

WIN?

45:15

>> YEAH.

45:16

I THINK THEY LIKELY WILL.

45:18

IF YOU LOOK AT THE SPEECH HE

45:20

GAVE IN WILDWOOD NEW JERSEY HE

45:23

WAS GIVING A PEACH TO HIS BASE

45:25

AND IT WAS VERY CLEAR THAT IS

45:27

WHAT HE WAS DOING.

45:29

THIS IS JOE BIDEN, AND THIS IS

45:32

THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT AND

45:33

KEEPING ME FROM CAMPAIGNING AND

45:36

THAT IS A MESSAGE THAT NOT ONLY

45:40

IS RECEPTIVE TO IN RALLIES A

45:43

TRIAL THAT INVOLVED HUSH MONEY

45:46

PAYMENTS TO A PORN STAR THAT HE

45:48

WAS CHEATING WITH ON HIS WIFE

45:50

AND THAT IS NOT THE NEWS THAT

45:53

YOU WANT TO APPEAL TO THE

45:53

VOTERS.

45:54

>> THE VOTERS ARE THE NIKKI

45:56

HALEY VOTERS.

45:58

COULD SHE POTENTIALLY BE TRUMP'S

45:59

RUNNINGMATE.

46:00

HE SAYS NO, HE'S NOT CONSIDERING

46:03

HER AND THOSE ARE THE VOTERS

46:04

THAT COULD MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

46:05

>> IT WILL BE A CLOSE RACE

46:07

AROUND SIX STATES.

46:09

TO MONICA'S POINT, THE BIDEN

46:12

TEAM FEELS THEY CAN ALREADY DO

46:14

THE

46:15

THE ORGANIZATIONAL STUFF THAT

46:17

THE TRUMP TEAM IS BEHIND ON.

46:20

JUST TO ADD TO IT, AS STEPHEN

46:21

POINTED OUT.

46:22

THERE HAVE BEEN POLLS THAT

46:24

SUGGEST THAT IF TRUMP IS

46:25

CONVICTED IT COULD MAKE A

46:26

DIFFERENCE.

46:26

I GUESS WE'LL SEE IN TERMS OF

46:29

HOW PEOPLE PERCEIVE IT.

46:32

YOU HAVE A WOMAN ON THE STAND,

46:34

AND SHE TALKED ABOUT BLACKING

46:36

OUT WHEN THE FORMER PRESIDENT OF

46:37

THE UNITED STATES WAS HAVING SEX

46:38

WITH HER.

46:40

THIS IS THE MAN WHO SAID WOMEN

46:46

SHOULD HAVE THEIR OWN CHOICES.

46:48

THOSE ARE UNDERESTIMATING THE

46:49

MOVEMENT OF WOMEN, WE'LL SEE AND

46:51

THE CHARACTER ASPECTS OF THIS

46:52

TRIAL AND THAT IS INTERESTING TO

46:54

ME TO SEE HOW THAT IMPACTS.

46:56

>> THE POLLS ARE JUST GETTING

46:58

TIGHTER, YOU GUYS.

47:00

FANTASTIC CONVERSATION, A PREESH

47:02

IT AND MANY MOTHER'S DAY.

47:05

>> HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY TO YOU.

47:07

>> THANK YOU.

47:07

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR

47:08

WATCHING AND HAPPY MOTHER'S DAY

47:10

TO YOU ALL OUT THERE AND WE'LL

47:11

BE BACK NEXT WEEK BECAUSE IF

47:13

IT'S SUNDAY, IT'S "MEET THE

47:13

PRESS."

47:14

♪ ♪

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