See Michael Cohen's first reaction to Trump's historic guilty verdict | MSNBC Exclusive
Summary
TLDRIn an interview, Michael Cohen, the prosecution's primary witness, discusses his relief and the lengthy process leading to the verdict in a major case involving former President Donald Trump. Cohen details the emotional and strategic aspects of the trial, highlighting the importance of accountability and justice. He critiques the defense strategy and reflects on his own experiences, including his time in prison and interactions with Trump. Cohen also addresses concerns about Trump's influence on his supporters and the broader implications for democracy and legal accountability.
Takeaways
- 📚 Michael Cohen, former personal attorney to Donald Trump, gave his first interview after the verdict was announced in a case where he testified as the primary witness.
- 🕵️♂️ Cohen expressed that he was not surprised by the verdict, emphasizing that the facts and documents spoke for themselves, despite media pundits' speculations.
- 🎬 The case involved an illegal conspiracy to influence the election through payments falsely booked as funds for something else, which Cohen described as a six-year process for accountability.
- 🏢 Cohen mentioned Allen Weisselberg and the involvement of Trump's Attorney General, Bill Barr, in attempts to stop the investigation after Cohen was imprisoned.
- 👨⚖️ Cohen felt that justice, though delayed, was not denied as the verdict demonstrated accountability with 34 counts of guilty, which he believes America needs more of.
- 🤔 Cohen speculated on Donald Trump's feelings post-verdict, drawing a parallel to his own sentencing and the difficulty of accepting the outcome.
- 👥 Cohen criticized the defense strategy, suggesting it was influenced by Trump and was not effective, ultimately leading to a 34-count guilty verdict.
- 🗣️ Cohen commented on his own demeanor during the trial, stating that he was calm and focused, despite the provocation and the media's portrayal of him as bombastic.
- 📝 Cohen highlighted the importance of documentary evidence and corroborating testimony from others, which he believes supported his claims made over the past six years.
- 🎥 The interview touched on the Access Hollywood tape and its impact on the case, with Cohen refuting the defense's argument that it was not a big deal and did not affect the campaign.
- 🚨 Cohen expressed concern about the potential for violence in response to the verdict but did not believe it would happen, citing the strength of law enforcement and the public's investment in Trump.
Q & A
What is the significance of the six-year process mentioned in the transcript?
-The six-year process refers to the lengthy legal journey involving Michael Cohen, who discussed accountability and his involvement in a case that started with his meeting with the District Attorney's Office and culminated in the recent verdict.
How did Michael Cohen react to the verdict?
-Michael Cohen expressed that he was not surprised by the verdict, emphasizing that he had consistently stated that the facts and documents would ultimately prevail in the case.
What is the relationship between the Access Hollywood tape and the Stormy Daniels scandal as discussed in the transcript?
-The defense argued that the Access Hollywood tape did not create new urgency to suppress the Stormy Daniels story, suggesting it was not a significant event. However, Cohen's experience contradicts this, as he was involved in damage control efforts following the tape's release.
What was Michael Cohen's role in the case described as an 'illegal conspiracy to influence the election'?
-Michael Cohen was involved in payments made to benefit a campaign, which were falsely booked as funds for something else. He was the only person who got into trouble for this scheme, as indicated in the transcript.
How did Cohen describe his experience with Todd Blanche during the trial?
-Cohen found Todd Blanche's questioning to be meandering and difficult to follow, which made it challenging to keep track of dates and events. He also perceived Trump's behavior in the courtroom as disrespectful to the jury.
What was the strategy behind Michael Cohen's demeanor during the trial?
-Cohen's strategy was to maintain a calm and composed demeanor throughout the trial, both on direct examination and cross-examination, to ensure he was believable and consistent to the jury.
How did Cohen's lawyer describe his client's performance during the trial?
-Cohen's lawyer praised his client for conducting himself remarkably well, emphasizing the importance of maintaining a consistent demeanor and connecting with the jury.
What was the impact of solitary confinement on Michael Cohen according to the transcript?
-Solitary confinement had a profound effect on Cohen, causing him to learn to live in his own head and leading to a change in his temperament, making it easier for him to stay calm during the trial.
What was the defense's strategy in relation to Michael Cohen's testimony, and how did Cohen respond to it?
-The defense strategy, speculated to be influenced by Trump, was to make the verdict a referendum on Cohen's credibility. Cohen dismissed this, stating that he only cared about the opinions of his family and close friends, and believed the strategy was foolish.
How did Cohen perceive the significance of the case involving Donald Trump?
-Cohen viewed the case as important and legitimate, even though it may not hold the same weight as other cases involving national security or insurrection. He emphasized the need for accountability for Trump, as no one should be above the law.
What were Michael Cohen's thoughts on the potential reactions and consequences following Trump's conviction?
-Cohen expressed concern about the potential for Trump to demand or expect his supporters to act in response to the conviction. However, he did not believe that the American people are as invested in Trump as he might think, and he trusted in the capabilities of law enforcement and the National Guard.
Outlines
🎥 Post-Verdict Interview with Michael Cohen
In this segment, Michael Cohen, former personal attorney to Donald Trump, gives his first interview after the verdict in a case where he was the prosecution's primary witness. The discussion revolves around Cohen's relief after six years of legal battles, his lack of surprise at the verdict due to his conviction in the facts and documents, and his reflections on the criminal scheme to influence the election through illegal payments. Cohen also addresses the broader implications of the verdict, emphasizing the importance of accountability for all, including former presidents, and shares his thoughts on Donald Trump's likely reaction to the verdict, drawing parallels to his own sentencing experience.
🤔 Reflecting on the Courtroom Dynamics and Strategy
This paragraph delves into the complexities of the courtroom proceedings, focusing on the challenges faced by Michael Cohen and his legal team in dealing with the prosecution's meandering questioning and the emotional strain of the trial. Cohen's attorney discusses the importance of maintaining composure and the strategy of staying calm under pressure, highlighting the significance of Cohen's demeanor in connecting with the jury. The conversation also touches on Cohen's solitary confinement experience and how it influenced his ability to manage his emotions during the trial. Additionally, there is a critique of the defense's strategy, which attempted to discredit Cohen, and an analysis of the impact of the 'Access Hollywood' tape on the case.
📚 The Importance of Documentary Evidence and Testimonies
Cohen emphasizes the role of documentary evidence and corroborating testimonies in establishing the truth of the case. He recounts his experience in London during the 'Access Hollywood' tape scandal and his efforts to manage the situation remotely. The discussion underscores the importance of text messages, emails, and other documents that supported Cohen's testimony and the narrative he has maintained for six years. The paragraph also addresses the public's perception of the case's significance compared to other legal issues surrounding Donald Trump and the need for accountability regardless of one's position.
👮♂️ Law Enforcement and the Future of Democracy
In this segment, the conversation turns to the broader implications of the verdict for the future of democracy and the potential for violence in response to the legal outcome. Cohen expresses skepticism about the likelihood of violence, citing the strength of law enforcement and the American people's detachment from Trump's narrative. He also discusses the potential for political maneuvers to shield Trump from legal consequences and the unprecedented nature of such actions. The paragraph concludes with Cohen's reflections on his own experience with the justice system and the importance of holding everyone accountable, including former presidents.
🚔 Confidence in Law Enforcement Amidst Legal Unrest
The final paragraph reinforces the confidence in law enforcement's ability to maintain order, particularly in New York, in the face of potential unrest following legal decisions. It highlights the professionalism and effectiveness of the police force and the National Guard, suggesting that these institutions are well-equipped to handle any threats to public safety. The paragraph also touches on the personal experiences of individuals involved in legal disputes and the desire to avoid unnecessary conflict and its consequences.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Verdict
💡Accountability
💡Prosecution
💡Witness
💡Guilty Counts
💡Legal Process
💡Defense
💡Testimony
💡Cross-examination
💡Justice
Highlights
Michael Cohen, former personal attorney to Donald Trump, discusses the six-year process leading to the recent verdict.
Cohen expresses no surprise at the verdict, emphasizing that the facts and documents speak for themselves.
Prosecutors described an illegal conspiracy to influence the election through payments falsely booked as funds for something else.
Cohen points out that he and Allen Weisselberg are the only ones held accountable for the scheme, despite others benefiting.
Bill Barr, Trump's Attorney General, allegedly told prosecutors to stop the investigation after Cohen was in prison.
Cohen feels justice, though delayed, was not denied as evidenced by the 34 counts of guilty.
Cohen speculates on Donald Trump's feelings post-verdict, drawing a parallel to his own sentencing experience.
Cohen criticizes Trump's courtroom behavior, suggesting it showed disrespect to the jury.
Cohen and his attorney discuss the difficulty of tracking Todd Blanche's meandering questioning during the trial.
Cohen's preparation for cross-examination focused on staying calm and focused, despite attempts to provoke and confuse him.
Cohen's lawyer emphasizes the importance of demeanor and the connection Cohen made with the jury.
Cohen reflects on the strategic necessity of staying cool and composed during the trial.
Cohen discusses the anxiety he felt about the trial's outcome and the importance of his testimony.
Cohen comments on the defense strategy, suggesting it was driven by Trump and was not effective.
Cohen dismisses the opinions of Trump and his family, stating he only cares about those close to him.
Cohen was in London during the Access Hollywood tape scandal, actively involved in damage control.
Cohen emphasizes the importance of documentary evidence and corroborating testimony in the case.
Cohen argues that the case is significant and should not be downplayed, despite other pending cases against Trump.
Cohen addresses concerns about potential violence or extralegal actions from Trump supporters post-verdict.
Cohen expresses confidence in law enforcement and the National Guard to maintain order.
Transcripts
GENERATIONS FROM NOW I DON'T
KNOW THAT WE WILL STILL HAVE
MOVIES, BUT THEY WILL BE THE
ONES HAVING BLOCKBUSTER
HOLOGRAMS MADE ABOUT THEM.
THANK YOU, MY FRIEND.
I KNOW WE WILL BE BACK WITH YOU
IN A MOMENT.
JOINING US ON SET FOR HIS FIRST
INTERVIEW SINCE TONIGHT'S
VERDICT WAS ANNOUNCED AS THE
PROSECUTION'S PRIMARY WITNESS
FROM THIS CASE, MICHAEL COHEN.
HE IS JOINED BY HIS ATTORNEY.
WE ARE THANKFUL TO YOU BOTH FOR
BEING HERE.
>> IT IS GOOD TO SEE YOU ALL.
>> HOW ARE YOU?
>> I GUESS THE WORD IS
RELIEVED.
THIS HAS BEEN SIX YEARS IN THE
MAKING.
REMEMBER THE VERY FIRST TIME I
MET WITH THE DISTRICT
ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, WE TALKED
ABOUT IT WHEN I WAS ON YOUR
SHOW.
AFTER PUTTING OUT "DISLOYAL."
THE FIRST TIME I MET WAS WHEN I
WAS AN INMATE IN OTISVILLE.
THEY CAME UP TO SEE ME ON THREE
SEPARATE OCCASIONS, SO THIS IS
A SIX-YEAR PROCESS FOR
ACCOUNTABILITY TO FINALLY BE
HAD.
>> WERE YOU SURPRISED BY THE
VERDICT?
>> NO, I WAS NOT.
I HAVE SPOKEN.
I'VE BEEN ON SO MANY OF THE
SHOWS AND I'VE TOLD YOU ALL
ALONG THAT THE FACTS SPEAK FOR
THEMSELVES.
THE DOCUMENTS SPEAK FOR
THEMSELVES.
I HAVE LISTENED TO SO MANY
PUNDITS COME ON THE SHOWS
INCLUDING THE HOST TALKING ABOUT
X, Y, AND THE.
THEY COULDN'T BE FURTHER FROM
THE TRUTH.
I WOULD HAVE A CONVERSATION
WITH MY LAWYER AND SAY I DON'T
UNDERSTAND IT.
HOW COME THEY DON'T SEE THE
SAME THINGS WE ARE SEEING?
I UNDERSTAND THAT IT MAKES
GREAT HEADLINES AND SO ON, BUT
THE FACTS ARE THE FACTS AND AT
THE END OF THE DAY THE FACTS
ARE WHAT PREVAILED HERE.
>> YOU MENTIONED THE TIMEFRAME,
WHAT IT HAS BEEN FOR YOU,
BEFORE TONIGHT THERE WAS THIS
CRIMINAL SCHEME DESCRIBED BY
PROSECUTORS.
THIS ILLEGAL CONSPIRACY TO
INFLUENCE THE ELECTION.
PAYMENTS TO BENEFIT THE
CAMPAIGN.
BOOKED FALSELY AS FUNDS FOR
SOMETHING ELSE.
IT HAS BEEN DESCRIBED BY
MULTIPLE PROSECUTORS, BUT
TONIGHT THERE WAS ONE PERSON
WHO GOT IN TROUBLE FOR THIS
SCHEME.
YOU ARE NOT THE BENEFICIARY,
BUT THE ONLY PERSON WHO HAD
BEEN IN TROUBLE FOR IT.
>> AS DID ALLEN WEISSELBERG.
>> TRUMP'S ATTORNEY GENERAL
BILL BARR TOLD ST Y TO STOP THE
INVESTIGATION AFTER YOU WERE IN
PRISON.
AFTER YOU GOT THE SHARP END OF
THAT STICK AND TO GET TRUMP'S
NAME OUT OF IT.
IT HAS BEEN EIGHT YEARS DOWN
THE ROAD.
I HAVE TO ASK YOU, YOU SAID
WHAT YOU FEEL ABOUT THE
VERDICT, BUT THAT IS JUSTICE
DELAYED.
IS JUSTICE DELAYED IS JUSTICE
DENIED?
>> CLEARLY NOT IN THIS CASE.
34 COUNTS, ONE AFTER ANOTHER,
AFTER ANOTHER, OF GUILTY.
IT IS ACCOUNTABILITY.
IT IS EXACTLY WHAT AMERICA
NEEDS RIGHT NOW.
WE NEED FOR ACCOUNTABILITY TO
BE HAD BY ALL THOSE WHO BREAK
THE LAW.
BECAUSE AS WE LIKE TO
CONTINUOUSLY STATE, NO ONE IS
ABOVE THE LAW AND TODAY'S
VERDICT DEMONSTRATES THAT.
>> HOW DO YOU THINK DONALD TRUMP
IS FEELING TODAY IN LIGHT OF
THIS VERDICT?
>> I CAN ONLY GO BACK TO WHEN
JUDGE POLLY SENTENCED ME TO 36
MONTHS.
YOU DON'T FEEL GOOD.
SENTENCING IS TERRIBLE.
I HAVE COURSE TOOK THE PLEA
THAT WAS GIVEN TO ME OR THEY
WERE FILING THE 80 PAGE
INDICTMENT THAT WAS GOING TO
INCLUDE MY WIFE.
IT NEVER FEELS GOOD.
I DID WHAT I HAD TO DO TO
PROTECT MY FAMILY.
THIS IS DIFFERENT.
DONALD DIDN'T LET IT GO IN
ORDER TO PROTECT HIS FAMILY.
HE TOOK IT ALL THE WAY AND
JUDGE MERCHAN, WHO IS AN
ABSOLUTE GENTLEMAN.
TO SEE HIM ON THAT STAND IS TO
SEE A MASTERFUL JUDGE WHO WAS
QUICK WITH DECISION-MAKING.
HE WAS ABSOLUTELY JUDICIAL
PERFECTION.
THE JURY HAD TREMENDOUS RESPECT
FOR HIM, AS DID I. WHICH IS
WHAT KEPT ME OFF MY SOCIAL
MEDIA.
IT WAS REALLY OUT OF RESPECT
FOR JUDGE MERCHAN AND THE
PROCESS THAT I DID EXACTLY THAT
AND THE JURY RESPECTS JUDGE
MERCHAN AND I BELIEVE A LOT OF
THE ANTICS THAT WENT ON IN THE
COURTROOM, WHETHER IT WAS BY
BLANCHE OR BY DONALD HIMSELF
WITH THE EYES CLOSING, THE
LEANING BACK, THE TOTAL
DISREGARD FOR THE JURY.
I DON'T THINK HE ENGENDERED ANY
POSITIVE FEELINGS BY ANYONE.
>> SOME PEOPLE SAID HE WAS
SLEEPING.
SOME PEOPLE SAID HE WAS RESTING
HIS EYES.
THERE ARE A LOT OF DIFFERENT
INTERPRETATIONS.
YOUR INTERPRETATION IS THAT HE
WAS DISRESPECTFUL TO THE JURY?
>> YES, BUT I WAS NOT
CONCENTRATING AS MUCH ON HIM AS
I WAS TRYING TO KEEP TRACK OF
TODD BLANCHE'S MEANDERING
QUESTIONING.
THAT WAS VERY DIFFICULT.
2018, 2019, 2020 AND TRYING TO
KEEP TRACK OF THE DATES AND
EVENTS WHEN YOU HAVE THAT TYPE
OF MEANDERING QUESTIONER.
IT IS NOT AN EASY PROCESS.
>> I WILL PUT THIS TO YOU AS
WELL.
IN PREPARING FOR THAT CROSS-
EXAMINATION FOR TODD BLANCHE,
DID YOU PREPARE EMOTIONALLY?
IT SEEMS LIKE FOR US JUST
WATCHING IT FOR THE COURTROOM
AND LOOKING AT THE TRANSCRIPT,
IT SEEMS LIKE A HERCULEAN
EFFORT TO STAY CALM AND WHAT
SEEMED TO BE DESIGNED TO
PROVOKE AND CONFUSE YOU?
>> A LOT OF OUR PREP FOCUSED ON
THE FACTS.
THERE IS SO MUCH PRIOR
TESTIMONY IN INTERVIEWS AND
STATEMENTS.
WE WANTED TO BE UP TO SPEED ON
THAT, REFRESHED.
>> THAT IS NOT AN ADVANTAGE
WHEN YOUR CLIENT HAS SPOKEN A
LOT IN PUBLIC.
>> HE HAS.
BUT YOU KNOW, IT WAS IMPORTANT
AND I EMPHASIZED THIS TO
MICHAEL.
HE CONDUCTED HIMSELF REMARKABLY
WELL.
I WANTED HIM TO UNDERSTAND THAT
HIS DEMEANOR MANNERED AND HE
NEEDED TO -- DEMEANOR MATTERED
AND HE NEEDED TO MAINTAIN THE
SAME ON DIRECT AND CROSS AND HE
DID THAT.
I SAW A CONNECTION BETWEEN HIM
AND THE JURY.
THEY BELIEVED HIM I THINK AND
THEY WERE JUST WITH HIM.
YES THERE WAS A LOT OF EMOTION
INVOLVED.
PAINFUL FOR ME AS HIS LAWYER TO
WATCH THE ATTACKS ON HIM.
85 TIMES HE WAS CALLED A LIAR.
HE IS NOT A LIAR.
HE HAS TOLD LIES AND ADMITTED
TO IT AND THE JURY BELIEVED HIM
AND RETURNED A SWIFT AND JUST
VERDICT.
I THINK ALL OF THE PREPARATION
WAS PUT TO GOOD USE.
>> THE STRATEGIC NECESSITY OF
YOU STAYING COOL AND HAVING
THAT SAME AFFECT AND
EVERYTHING, HOW HARD WAS IT?
>> NOT HARD AT ALL.
IT IS THE MEDIA THAT WANTS TO
PORTRAY ME AS A BOMBASTIC
CHARACTER.
>> WE HAVE ALL HEARD IT FROM
YOU.
>> BUT YOU HEARD IT FROM MY
PODCASTS.
IT IS A PERSONA FOR IT.
I CAN'T GO WITH INTELLIGENCE,
SO I HAVE TO GO WITH BOMBASTIC,
RIGHT?
IT IS NOT NECESSARILY MY
AFFECT.
YES I GET HOT TEMPERED.
YES WE HAVE HEARD THAT A COUPLE
OF TIMES HERE AND THERE WHEN I
WAS WORKING FOR MR. TRUMP.
THAT IS NOT GENERALLY MY AFFECT
AND IT WASN'T HARD.
I WILL TELL YOU THOUGH, 51 DAYS
OF SOLITARY CONFINEMENT CHANGES
ANYONE AND EVERYONE.
YOU START TO LEARN TO LIVE IN
YOUR OWN HEAD, WHICH IS A
DANGEROUS PLACE FOR ANYONE.
IT IS VERY EASY TO TURN AROUND
AND SAY I NEED TO PULL BACK ON
MYSELF.
I NEED TO PULL BACK ON GETTING
ANGRY AT THE NONSENSE OF TODD
BLANCHE.
AND IT WAS NOT AS DIFFICULT AS
I THOUGHT.
STAYING FOCUSED WITH HIS
QUESTIONING, THAT WAS MORE
DIFFICULT.
THE ANXIETY AND STEALING WITH
THE ANXIETY ON THIS WAS
DIFFICULT AS WELL.
>> WHAT KIND OF ANXIETY?
>> YOU KNOW, I AM NERVOUS.
I WAS NERVOUS BECAUSE SO MUCH
WAS RIDING ON THE RESULT OF
THIS AND I WANTED TO ENSURE MY
TESTIMONY WAS PERFECT.
AFTERWARDS WHEN THE WHOLE THING
WAS OVER, WE SAT AND SPOKE FOR
A LITTLE BIT ABOUT MY TESTIMONY.
AND COULDN'T UNDERSTAND SOME OF
THE CRITICISMS.
ONE MINUTE AND 39 SECONDS, HOW
COULD YOU POSSIBLY HAVE TWO
CONVERSATIONS?
YOU CAN, WHEN ONE IS NOT A
STATUS CALL, JUST AN UPDATE.
I WANT YOU TO KNOW EVERYTHING
IS TAKEN CARE OF, WE ARE GOOD.
THAT IS THE CONVERSATIONS THAT
TAKE PLACE WITH DONALD TRUMP,
NOT THIS LONG-WINDED --
INCLUDING THE TAPE I RECORDED
OF HIM, WHICH I TOLD YOU FOR
DAVID PECKER.
THAT WAS ONLY LIKE A MINUTE
AND CHANGE.
BUT THAT WAS A SUBSTANTIVE
CONVERSATION.
IMAGINE WHAT YOU COULD DO IN
1:39.
I THOUGHT JOSH STEINGLASS DID A
FABULOUS JOB PUTTING THAT 1:39
OUT THERE.
SUSAN HOFFINGER IS PHENOMENAL.
THE WHOLE TEAM, THE WHOLE
PROSECUTORIAL TEAM WERE
INCREDIBLE AS WE WOULD GO
THROUGH SOME OF THE DOCUMENTS.
SHE KNEW OFF THE TOP OF HER
HEAD MOST OF THE NUMBERS, MOST
OF THE EXHIBIT NUMBERS.
A VERY IMPRESSIVE GROUP OF
PEOPLE.
>> WHAT DID YOU MAKE OF THE
DECISION BY THE DEFENSE, AND WE
ARE SPECULATING A LOT OF THE
STRATEGY WAS DRIVEN BY TRUMP
HIMSELF.
WE ARE SPECULATING BECAUSE WE
DON'T KNOW, BUT IT FELT LIKE IT.
THEY MADE A STRATEGIC DECISION
TO MAKE THE VERDICT A
REFERENDUM ON YOU, INCLUDING
SAYING, BEING ADMONISHED BY THE
JUDGE FOR SAYING IT,
ESSENTIALLY THE LAST WORD TO
THE JURY, DO NOT SEND ANYONE TO
PRISON ON THE WORD OF MICHAEL
COHEN.
HOW WAS THAT FOR YOU AND WHAT
YOU MAKE OF THAT DECISION?
>> I DON'T REALLY CARE, NOR DO
I CARE WHAT TODD BLANCHE CARES
ABOUT ME.
WHAT I CARE ABOUT IS MY WIFE,
MY DAUGHTER, MY SON, MY
PARENTS, MY CLOSE FRIENDS.
THAT IS WHO I CARE ABOUT AND
WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT ME.
DANYA PERRY, I CARE WHAT SHE
SAYS ABOUT ME.
I DON'T CARE WHAT DON, IVANKA,
ERIC, DON JUNIOR, IT DOESN'T
MATTER TO ME WHAT ANY OF THEM
SAY ABOUT ME.
I KNOW WHO I AM AND I KNEW WHAT
I NEEDED TO DO, SO IN THIS
SPECIFIC CASE IT WAS A VERY,
AND I HAVE SAID IT, IT WAS A
VERY FOOLISH STRATEGY.
AND HE IS NOT REALLY KNOWN AS A
DEFENSE ATTORNEY.
I THINK IT IS ONLY THE SECOND
DEFENSE TRIAL.
NOT A GOOD STRATEGY AND PROOF
POSITIVE OF THAT IS THE 34
COUNT VERDICT.
>> THE DEFENSE COUNSEL WE ARE
TALKING ABOUT, TODD BLANCHE,
DID AN INTERVIEW ON ANOTHER
CABLE NEWS NETWORK THIS
EVENING.
I WILL LET YOU GUESS WHICH ONE.
HE SAID IN THAT INTERVIEW THAT
EVERY DECISION IN THE CASE,
EVERY SUBSTANTIVE DECISION IN
THE CASE IS ONE HE MADE
TOGETHER WITH TRUMP.
>> IT MAKES SENSE.
>> I WAS GOING TO ASK IF YOU
SEE TRUMP'S FINGERPRINTS ON
SOME OF THE DECISIONS YOU ARE
DESCRIBING.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
THE WORD, GLOAT, IT IS A DONALD
TRUMP, FOURTH GRADE, PLAYGROUND
BULLYING KIND OF TACTIC.
WHAT IS THAT?
>> DID YOU HAVE AN ACRONYM FOR
TODD?
>> I DID, THE STUPIDEST LAWYER
OF ALL TIME.
YOU CANNOT LISTEN TO YOUR
CLIENT WHEN YOU'RE TRYING TO
CREATE A DEFENSE.
A DEFENSE THAT IS AS IMPORTANT
AS THIS IS THE VERY FIRST
PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES,
FORMER PRESIDENT TO EVER BE
CHARGED WITH A CRIME, LET ALONE
CONVICTED NOW ON 34 COUNTS.
IT WAS DEFINITIVELY THE
STUPIDEST LAWYER OF ALL TIME.
WORSE THAN SOME OF THE OTHER
ONES THAT HE HAS, YOU KNOW, IN
HIS ORBIT.
IT MADE NO SENSE AT ALL AND ANY
GOOD LAWYER, IF HE WOULD HAVE
TRIED TO GET A HOLD OF DANYA,
SHE WOULD NOT LISTEN TO HIS
DESIRE TO CONTROL HOW THE CASE
WOULD PROCEED.
THAT IS NOT HOW YOU RUN A GOOD
DEFENSE.
I WOULD NEVER HAVE ALLOWED IT
IF I WAS STILL WITH HIM.
>> LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT AN
ELEMENT OF THE DEFENSE THAT I
FOUND PUZZLING AS AN OBSERVER
AND IT WAS ABOUT THE ACCESS
HOLLYWOOD TAPE.
THE DEFENSE ARGUED THAT THERE
WAS NO NEW URGENCY FROM TRUMP
TO KILL THE STORMY DANIELS STORY
AFTER THE ACCESS HOLLYWOOD
TAPE, BECAUSE IT WAS NO BIG
DEAL AND IT DIDN'T HAVE AN
IMPACT ON THE CAMPAIGN AND DID
NOT CHANGE ANYONE'S MIND SET
ABOUT THE POTENTIAL DAMAGE THAT
COULD BE DONE BY ANOTHER SEX
SCANDAL, PARTICULARLY A SEX
SCANDAL LIKE THIS.
THE REASON THAT WAS PUZZLING TO
A LOT OF US WATCHING IT IS
BECAUSE WE WERE ALIVE THEN AND
IT SEEMED LIKE A VERY BIG DEAL
THEN AND WOULD HAVE RATIONALLY
HAD AN IMPACT ON THE WAY THEY
WERE THINKING ABOUT POTENTIAL
DAMAGE ON THESE STORIES.
YOU WERE CLOSE TO DONALD TRUMP
OF THE TIME AND INVOLVED IN THE
RESPONSE.
HOW DOES THAT GO WITH YOUR
LIVED EXPERIENCE?
>> COMPLETELY CONTRARY TO THE
REALITY.
I WAS IN LONDON AT THE TIME,
VISITING MY DAUGHTER WHO WAS STUDYING AT QUEEN MARY
STUDYING AT QUEEN MARY
UNIVERSITY FOR THE SEMESTER.
IT WAS HER 21st BIRTHDAY, NOT
TO MENTION SEVERAL DAYS AFTER
WERE MY ANNIVERSARY, SO WE WERE
THERE, CELEBRATING AS A FAMILY
WHEN THIS THING HAPPENED.
I SPENT MOST OF THE VACATION
OUTSIDE OF THE RESTAURANT, ON
THE TELEPHONE WITH PEOPLE LIKE
HOPE HICKS AND OTHERS, TRYING
TO DO DAMAGE CONTROL.
THAT WAS DEMONSTRATED AGAIN BY
THE EVIDENCE, WHETHER IT WAS
TEXT MESSAGES OR, YOU KNOW,
CORROBORATING TESTIMONY.
THAT IS WHAT I HAD CONTINUOUSLY
SAID WHEN I WAS ON NICOLE'S
SHOW OR JOYS SHOW OR ANY OF THE
MSNBC SHOWS.
THIS IS A CASE THAT IS GOING TO
COME DOWN TO THE DOCUMENTARY
EVIDENCE AND THE TESTIMONY OF
OTHERS.
AND WHAT ULTIMATELY WAS
DEMONSTRATED WAS THE FACT THAT
ALL OF THE TESTIMONY BY THE
OTHER WITNESSES THAT I HAD
INVOLVEMENT WITH CORROBORATED
WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING FOR SIX
YEARS AND ALL OF THE EVIDENCE,
THE DOCUMENTARY EVIDENCE,
EMAILS, TEXT MESSAGES,
DOCUMENTS THEMSELVES, AGAIN
CORROBORATED WHAT I HAVE BEEN
SAYING FOR SIX YEARS.
>> THIS CASE WAS, I THINK, NOT
DERIDED BUT DOWNPLAYED BY A LOT
OF PEOPLE WHEN IT BECAME CLEAR
IT WAS ONE OF FOUR CRIMINAL
INDICTMENTS IN FOUR DIFFERENT
JURISDICTIONS.
THIS WAS SEEN, I THINK, AS THE
LIGHTWEIGHT CASE.
THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF
DISCUSSION IN THE MEDIA.
WE CALL THIS THE HUSH MONEY
CASE?
IS THIS AN ELECTION
INTERFERENCE CASE?
HOW DO WE SHORTHAND THIS?
DO YOU THINK THAT THIS CASE WAS
SUBSTANTIVELY IMPORTANT,
COMPARED WITH A CLASSIFIED
DOCUMENT CASE AND JANUARY 6
CASE AND THE OTHER ONES THAT
ARE PENDING THAT MAY NEVER COME
TO TRIAL, IS THIS ONE IMPORTANT
ON ITS OWN?
>> THE ANSWER IS YES IT IS, BUT
I MYSELF ON VARIOUS DIFFERENT
SHOWS OF SAID WHY ARE WE
LOOKING AT THESE CASES LIKE IT
IS THE KENTUCKY DERBY AND WE
ARE HANDICAPPING THE CASES?
IF IN FACT THIS WAS, IT WOULD BE
THE FOURTH MOST OBSCENE CASE
THAT DONALD IS BEING CHARGED
WITH.
NOW OBVIOUSLY THIS CASE DOES
NOT HOLD EQUAL WEIGHT TO THE
THEFT OF NUCLEAR SECRETS.
THE DOCUMENT, THE MAR-A-LAGO
DOCUMENT CASE OR THE
INSURRECTION, THE JANUARY 6
INSURRECTION.
IT JUST DOESN'T.
EVEN THE ATTEMPT TO OVERTURN
FREE AND FAIR ELECTIONS.
NEVERTHELESS THIS IS AN
IMPORTANT CASE.
IT IS A LEGITIMATE CASE AND
WHILE I WOULD HAVE LIKED ALVIN
BRAGG TO HAVE BROUGHT IT A YEAR
EARLIER, BECAUSE IT WOULD'VE
BEEN GOOD FOR ME.
I WOULD HAVE BEEN, A YEAR
EARLIER, FINISHED WITH THIS, IT
IS AN IMPORTANT CASE.
IT IS A RELEVANT CASE.
IT IS AN ILLEGAL ACT THAT ANY
ONE OF US WOULD HAVE ALREADY
BEEN PROSECUTED FOR AND AGAIN,
SINCE NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW,
DONALD NEEDED TO BE HELD
ACCOUNTABLE, JUST LIKE ANY OF
US.
LIKE I WAS HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
THE DIFFERENCE, I TOOK
RESPONSIBILITY.
>> I WILL SAY TO MY COLLEAGUES,
I AM BEING UNCOOL AND NOT
LETTING YOU IN HERE.
I HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION I WANT
TO ASK YOU.
A LOT OF THE REASON THAT I THINK
THIS IS BEING GREETED THE WAY
THAT IT IS ACROSS THE COUNTRY,
THREE INCH HEADLINES ON EVERY
NEWSPAPER IN THE COUNTRY.
IT IS NOT NECESSARILY BECAUSE
EVERYONE IS TOTALLY ENGAGED IN
FALSIFYING BUSINESS RECORDS.
THE ACTUAL DETAILS OF THIS IS
NOT WHAT IS DRIVING IT.
WHAT IS DRIVING AT IS THAT HE
IS THE FIRST PRESIDENT
CONVICTED OF A CRIME AND WHAT
IS HE GOING TO DO?
WE ARE VERY WORRIED ABOUT WHAT
TRUMP MAY DEMAND OR EXPECT HIS
SUPPORTERS TO DO IN RESPONSE TO
THIS.
THE EXTRALEGAL PRESSURE THAT HE
BRINGS TO BEAR ON EVERY
SITUATION WHEN HE FEELS
VICTIMIZED NOW.
FOR THE FUTURE OF OUR DEMOCRACY.
I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR WHAT YOU
THINK ABOUT THAT, HOW YOU
CALIBRATE THAT AND HOW YOU HAVE
DEALT WITH WHAT I KNOW HAS BEEN
THE ANXIETY AROUND THE THREAT
LEVEL FOR YOU AND YOUR FAMILY.
>> I KNOW HE HAS THE SERIES OF
REPUBLICANS WHO SHOW UP TO
COURT WITH HIM, TO PASS A LAW
WHEREBY HE CANNOT BE HELD
LEGALLY ACCOUNTABLE FOR ANY
CRIME.
I'VE NEVER HEARD OF ANYTHING
LIKE THIS.
HE HAS HIS OWN SET OF
CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS THAT NONE
OF US ARE AFFORDED THE SAME.
THIS IS GOING TO BE AN ALL NEW
LAW CLASS FOR THESE POOR LAW
STUDENTS RIGHT NOW.
THEY WILL HAVE TO TAKE ANOTHER
COURSE.
MAYBE DANYA WILL BE TEACHING
IT.
WILL HE LOOKED TO CREATE
VIOLENCE?
SURE.
WILL IT HAPPEN?
I DON'T THINK SO.
I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THE
AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE AS INVESTED
IN HIM AS HE BELIEVES.
WE HAVE ALREADY SEEN WHAT
HAPPENED WITH THE OATH KEEPERS,
STEWART RHODES, 18 YEARS.
I SPENT 13 MONTHS AT OTISVILLE.
A SATELLITE CAMP.
51 DAYS IN SOLITARY CONFINEMENT.
I ASSURE YOU, NOBODY WANTS THAT
FOR THEMSELVES.
SO NO ONE IS GOING TO GO OUT
AND DO SOMETHING STUPID,
ESPECIALLY LET'S SAY IN NEW
YORK.
WE HAVE THE GREATEST LAW
ENFORCEMENT IN NEW YORK.
OUR MEN AND WOMEN IN BLUE, THE
BEST.
THEY ARE ALSO GREAT IN ALL OF
THE OTHER CITIES AND ALL OF THE
OTHER STATES IN OUR COUNTRY.
THEN WE HAVE THE NATIONAL GUARD.
5.0 / 5 (0 votes)
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